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welcome to the skeptic zone the podcast

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from Australia for science and reason

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yuria hosts Richard Saunders and Stefan

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welcome back Richard back from the big

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dragon con how is it how are you going

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I'm doing well you know I I you'd think

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I'd be completely screwed up with time

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zones and jet lag but you like crazy no

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I wasn't there long enough to get jet

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lag what to feel the effects on there

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feel the effects on coming back I don't

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leave any effects over that ok you got

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back in your fine again um pretty well

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that's good so how was it amazing as you

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will find out no doubt when you come

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next you know i'm booked it in i'm sick

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of all these big junkets and jorts that

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the that the zone does and I don't tag

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along it's just not right there we were

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you know doing the show everything live

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which you'll hear next week because you

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know next week is our one year

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anniversary of the show one really isn't

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any year it's been a year we're making

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this huh it feels like five how do you

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know the area don't wait for next week

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this this episode skeptics own number 48

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for the eighteenth of September while I

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was there I had an interview with seth

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shostack Oh Seth isn't he a city guy is

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the search for extraterrestrial

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intelligence cv city guy what's a good

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question X he's one of these there you

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gotta find it that's it quite a big

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movement too and I suppose we're going

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to find out if there's even an inkling

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of anything going on we'll find out if

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there's there been any messages from

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extraterrestrials and his views on the

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long-term future of humans of human what

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will we do will we move out into space

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what are we going to do we evolve into

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something else hmm and evolve the law

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back to dinosaurs have already we're

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kind of getting it also another great

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show this is second the show just before

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the big anniversary so it's of inverse

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right-hand altum its celebration today

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and a bit of a twist um normally would

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have the think tank yeah and still do

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have the think tank but it's a new

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zealand think tank in new zealand Kylie

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Sturgis after visiting us at DragonCon

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jump on a plane went to Auckland New

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Zealand or just skeptics in the pub and

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recorded a think tank in New Zealand

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well for those folks haven't been to

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Auckland I there once and when you're

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talking about skipped if you in the pub

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I don't know how they would have even

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chosen

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pub to go because in every single

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building in the city of Auckland is a

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pub is it there actually yeah it's one

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after i look at this seem tight i would

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for being walk around yeah every single

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place was a pub there's no shops there's

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no milk bars as though restaurants they

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are all there's about a thousand pubs in

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the city centre so what'll be fun it's

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great one out it's a close behind you

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Stefan if you reach over there there's a

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magazine Ricci yeah uh-oh what's this

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what a spectacular cover it's the new

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skeptic magazine a new skeptic magazine

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from Australian skeptics you can

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subscribe at ww skeptics calm you this

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is really good and it's by our new

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editor Tim mendham so it's a new look

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magazine this a lot of interesting

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articles as a story of their about the

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amazing meeting it is chock-a-block

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chock-a-block there's a bit about an

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interview of joe nickell in there

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there's all sorts of things 64 pages yep

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it's a bumper edition it's fantastic so

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the new skeptic magazine is out

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available now you can subscribe on the

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website this looks like it should be the

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news agents it is us it's in a few news

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agents but we're working to get it in

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all it should be it all this is fabulous

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well well done get a sceptic thank you

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new editor Tim mendham well I can't wait

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to hear from seth shostack oh let's just

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get straight into the show let's do it

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Seth Shostak is an American astronomer

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he earned his physics degree from

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Princeton University and a PhD in

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astronomy from the California Institute

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of Technology he is the senior

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astronomer at the SETI Institute in

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Mountain View California and I caught up

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with Seth at DragonCon well we're here

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at dragon on in 2009 in Atlanta Georgia

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and I'm sitting here with dr. Steve

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Roberts from the Australian skeptics I

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Steve hi Richard and we're chatting with

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seth shostack myself hi rich very

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pleased that you could spare some time

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to speak to us today as the vacuum and

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is running around and elevators going up

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and down but it all adds to the to the

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ambience is just like a good restaurant

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it's like a good restaurant now you get

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a very interesting talk and I might kick

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off with that today in fact about the

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possible future of humanity in relation

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to population in the space why is that

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such an interest of yours well I think

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it's probably an interest of everyone at

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some point because you know you always

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want to know what's going to happen I've

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read quite a number of books about the

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long-term future the universe in fact I

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was going to write a book about the

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long-term future of the universe but

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it's hard for people to relate to

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something that might happen 10 to the

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hundredth years from now which is a lot

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and whereas if you're talking about

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things that might happen in 40 50 60

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years now that is interesting so I think

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that that's what prompted my particular

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interest in this subject actually so you

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hear these stories that the sun's going

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to go into a red giant in so many

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billion years you can we start panicking

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now we don't have to worry right exactly

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i mean you most people will say you know

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it no skin off my nose i don't care what

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having some five billion years and

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besides five billion years so now we'll

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have moved somewhere else anyhow so you

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know and it's hard to argue with that

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but if you if you say look actually

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after two hundred thousand years of Homo

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sapiens we may be running into some

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fundamental limits in the next

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generation then that's interesting and I

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I don't speak here of the usual concerns

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a global warming and so forth those are

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all serious but you know there are many

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people working about that these are

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other other concerns that i think are

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more fundamental actually right so

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you're really talking about things that

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can conceivably affect us possibly or at

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least it how children or legend yes

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absolutely i think what happens is that

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you run into limits in terms of how much

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energy you can dump into the atmosphere

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you run into limits of the kinds of

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metals and other resources that are

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necessary for a decent life style you

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know fundamental things not oil you can

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always replace oil but other things that

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like copper they run out of that that

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really make it very difficult to keep

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technological society going so these are

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all things that have time scales for

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from you know twenty to a hundred years

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somewhere there and you're mentioning in

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your talk the prospects of moving out

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from the planet talking about the moon

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asteroids Mars possibly do you do you

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perceive that happening within a

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relatively short time well if you look

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at the current NASA budgets one is not

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too optimistic about their move toward

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toward outer space and you know if we

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wanted to colonize the Moon and Mars we

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could do so certainly within a

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generation if you wanted to try that on

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you really think that would be feasible

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it's possible to do it its autonomy oh

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yeah it's all a matter of yes it's all a

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matter of whether you really want to do

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it I mean it's in a technology problem

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it's mostly money problem right I mean

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we got to the mood like 40 years ago

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well we could get back to the moon if

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you really wanted I agree with you I

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think we could get back there very

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easily there's a money problem but when

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you consider that that's one thing

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to actually set up a permanent community

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say on the moon how would you even begin

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to tackle the problem of water well

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water would have to be recycled it turns

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out that there may be quite a bit of

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water actually on the moon but it's on

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the South Pole and it's ice is frozen

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but in the shadowed regions of the South

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Pole of the moon there's very good

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evidence that there's some water there

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quite a bit of water action you could

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pipe that around you don't want to carry

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water from the earth so you know how

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long does it take to colonize the moon

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in some substantial fashion I mean right

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Captain Cook Lance in Botany Bay in 1770

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or whenever it was and within 30 years

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you know Australia was a sort of a

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thriving place you know I I don't know

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that all the residents were on the up

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and up but you know it was they were

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able to survive these fatal shores right

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so if they could do that then I I do

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believe that we could colonize the Moon

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or Mars but I actually don't put a whole

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lot of stock in that that's not the

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salvation of the planet I mean I think

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it's something we should do and that we

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probably will do but if you're really

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talking about how to combat the kinds of

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short-term problems we're going to run

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into you need I think artificial

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habitats or maybe the asteroids let's do

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that that slide you had to the little

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base sitting on an asteroid now wouldn't

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you have all sorts of problems with the

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asteroid in its orbit would it could

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have possibly go eccentric or they're

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pretty stable well there are bits of

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fairly stable insofar as they don't

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interact with anything else occasionally

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they interact with one another occasion

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you'll get an asteroid you know hit you

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but that you know the chances of that

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happening are very very small in the

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movies whenever they go through the

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asteroid belt you see this you know hole

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hey love rocks coming your way that's

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slightly exaggerated actually if you

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were on an asteroid looking around for

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other asteroids you probably wouldn't

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see any and if you did you need

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binoculars and you see a pinpoint of

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light so yeah so the chances you're

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going to get hit by another asteroid

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they're pretty small that isn't your

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worst problem if you're on an asteroid

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maybe the lack of you know atmosphere

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that might bother you more that might

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bother you more and maybe its own

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rotation possibly know the rotation

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might be good to give you you know I

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don't know you changed change of view

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with the kasambahay did nothing one

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anyway well it's true at the asteroid

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belt then since it's maybe three times

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farther away from the Sun and the earth

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is and that means the intensity is down

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by a factor of 10 more or less so it's

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ten percent of the sunlight you have

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here on earth that's that's dimmer you

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would notice that the sunlight seems

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weaker but you could still grow things

270
00:10:07,789 --> 00:10:04,679
and so forth I mean it would be like a

271
00:10:09,319 --> 00:10:07,799
cloudy day you know you could you could

272
00:10:11,329 --> 00:10:09,329
survive with that level of sunlight I

273
00:10:13,569 --> 00:10:11,339
think that that's not such a formidable

274
00:10:15,590 --> 00:10:13,579
problem it's getting back to this

275
00:10:17,449 --> 00:10:15,600
interesting point about you're on an

276
00:10:19,009 --> 00:10:17,459
asteroid and you could possibly see

277
00:10:20,780 --> 00:10:19,019
another one going by oh you used

278
00:10:21,889 --> 00:10:20,790
binoculars or whatever but we're still

279
00:10:23,960 --> 00:10:21,899
talking about something within the

280
00:10:26,139 --> 00:10:23,970
confines of the solar system so you're

281
00:10:29,900 --> 00:10:26,149
getting light reflected from the Sun and

282
00:10:32,119 --> 00:10:29,910
I just had a thought in the space movies

283
00:10:34,699 --> 00:10:32,129
you see Enterprise going through

284
00:10:36,139 --> 00:10:34,709
interstellar space you see the spaceship

285
00:10:37,910 --> 00:10:36,149
going through interstellar space if it

286
00:10:40,460 --> 00:10:37,920
wasn't lit up artificially from its own

287
00:10:41,869 --> 00:10:40,470
lights would you see or would it be so

288
00:10:42,949 --> 00:10:41,879
dark it was here that all you see

289
00:10:44,329 --> 00:10:42,959
spacecraft well that depends on whether

290
00:10:46,489 --> 00:10:44,339
it had windows who lights on on the

291
00:10:47,749 --> 00:10:46,499
inside I mean you might see oh I doubt

292
00:10:49,309 --> 00:10:47,759
that would have navigation lights what's

293
00:10:52,369 --> 00:10:49,319
the point of that usually the outside of

294
00:10:53,840 --> 00:10:52,379
the Hollister's yet my stall in 15 you

295
00:10:55,460 --> 00:10:53,850
wouldn't sit you wouldn't see it well I

296
00:10:56,480 --> 00:10:55,470
mean there's a bit of a starlight I mean

297
00:10:58,340 --> 00:10:56,490
you know if you had really good night

298
00:10:59,929 --> 00:10:58,350
vision maybe you could pick it out but

299
00:11:01,369 --> 00:10:59,939
in general no you know it's not gonna be

300
00:11:02,960 --> 00:11:01,379
a lot of lights used to be and you

301
00:11:04,309 --> 00:11:02,970
wouldn't hear it either by the way if to

302
00:11:06,980 --> 00:11:04,319
be where the camera is to see it

303
00:11:08,449 --> 00:11:06,990
everywhere the camera is now of course

304
00:11:09,079 --> 00:11:08,459
after you got spend some time in

305
00:11:10,939 --> 00:11:09,089
Australia

306
00:11:13,489 --> 00:11:10,949
yeah I was delighted hear about

307
00:11:15,980 --> 00:11:13,499
early on and the Netherlands is this the

308
00:11:18,019 --> 00:11:15,990
and Steve you've certainly lived around

309
00:11:20,480 --> 00:11:18,029
the orders is the fate of the astronomer

310
00:11:22,340 --> 00:11:20,490
the travel well there is a lot of travel

311
00:11:23,660 --> 00:11:22,350
with astronomy in the old days that was

312
00:11:25,040 --> 00:11:23,670
primarily because the telescopes were

313
00:11:26,509 --> 00:11:25,050
never where you were living because you

314
00:11:29,150 --> 00:11:26,519
don't live on top of a mountain by

315
00:11:31,160 --> 00:11:29,160
preference or as a radio astronomer out

316
00:11:33,199 --> 00:11:31,170
in the deserts or some you know place

317
00:11:35,239 --> 00:11:33,209
which is very far from civilization as

318
00:11:36,559 --> 00:11:35,249
we know it I mean in Australia the

319
00:11:37,790 --> 00:11:36,569
reason that the parks telescope is out

320
00:11:39,769 --> 00:11:37,800
in the sheep country it's not because

321
00:11:41,960 --> 00:11:39,779
you know they like mutton so much it's

322
00:11:43,280 --> 00:11:41,970
the fact that it's far away from a lot

323
00:11:44,329 --> 00:11:43,290
of people where you get radio

324
00:11:47,600 --> 00:11:44,339
interference caused by whatever

325
00:11:49,639 --> 00:11:47,610
machinery to have yeah so there's that

326
00:11:51,049 --> 00:11:49,649
travel but in addition astronomy's an

327
00:11:52,999 --> 00:11:51,059
international endeavor it's one of these

328
00:11:54,230 --> 00:11:53,009
Sciences that is conducted

329
00:11:56,569 --> 00:11:54,240
internationally fact they're very few

330
00:11:57,559 --> 00:11:56,579
sciences that or not and as a

331
00:11:59,720 --> 00:11:57,569
consequence of that there are always

332
00:12:01,280 --> 00:11:59,730
meetings their conventions and so forth

333
00:12:02,509 --> 00:12:01,290
are just talking with your colleagues or

334
00:12:04,040 --> 00:12:02,519
maybe you have an experiment that

335
00:12:05,569 --> 00:12:04,050
involves the people in other countries

336
00:12:08,840 --> 00:12:05,579
so there is a lot of international

337
00:12:11,179 --> 00:12:08,850
travel and does that mean occasionally

338
00:12:13,669 --> 00:12:11,189
you are required to visit a certain area

339
00:12:16,100 --> 00:12:13,679
or in a servitor II because that's where

340
00:12:18,110 --> 00:12:16,110
a specialist bit of equipment is yes

341
00:12:19,819 --> 00:12:18,120
that is often the case I mean we went to

342
00:12:23,540 --> 00:12:19,829
parks the Parkes radio telescope for

343
00:12:25,220 --> 00:12:23,550
many months in 1995 because this was a

344
00:12:28,069 --> 00:12:25,230
very large antenna in the southern

345
00:12:29,749 --> 00:12:28,079
hemisphere right half the sky that they

346
00:12:31,790 --> 00:12:29,759
can see we can't see so well from the

347
00:12:34,879 --> 00:12:31,800
northern hemisphere big advantage of

348
00:12:37,460 --> 00:12:34,889
having a astronomy in Australia they

349
00:12:38,929 --> 00:12:37,470
have access to the southern sky and so

350
00:12:40,400 --> 00:12:38,939
we brought the receiving equipment we

351
00:12:41,989 --> 00:12:40,410
need and we just bolted it onto the

352
00:12:42,940 --> 00:12:41,999
parts telescope for a couple of couple

353
00:12:45,040 --> 00:12:42,950
months

354
00:12:47,080 --> 00:12:45,050
that's interesting you've been two parts

355
00:12:48,550 --> 00:12:47,090
piece of year xavier so a fairly remote

356
00:12:51,400 --> 00:12:48,560
country town it has two must be near a

357
00:12:53,680 --> 00:12:51,410
town because the people who work they

358
00:12:56,380 --> 00:12:53,690
have to live somewhere and buy food yes

359
00:12:58,150 --> 00:12:56,390
indeed have a school zone yes it's about

360
00:12:59,950 --> 00:12:58,160
a half hour drive I think and there's

361
00:13:02,560 --> 00:12:59,960
also that leave the technicians to be

362
00:13:04,720 --> 00:13:02,570
Paris and also the FL community based

363
00:13:07,810 --> 00:13:04,730
somewhere near to let's go that's right

364
00:13:09,220 --> 00:13:07,820
yes some telescopes sort of travel and

365
00:13:10,570 --> 00:13:09,230
astronomy though you need to travel just

366
00:13:13,030 --> 00:13:10,580
to get a conference in suite other

367
00:13:15,340 --> 00:13:13,040
astronomers yes oh thank you the same in

368
00:13:18,160 --> 00:13:15,350
most fields of endeavor and even

369
00:13:20,140 --> 00:13:18,170
skepticism yes yes I I don't think it's

370
00:13:22,960 --> 00:13:20,150
fundamentally any any different than any

371
00:13:24,340 --> 00:13:22,970
other line of work unless you your line

372
00:13:27,820 --> 00:13:24,350
of work doesn't involve international

373
00:13:30,210 --> 00:13:27,830
collaboration although that of course as

374
00:13:35,710 --> 00:13:30,220
you say going to the southern hemisphere

375
00:13:38,200 --> 00:13:35,720
you get a completely different view the

376
00:13:40,930 --> 00:13:38,210
big thing you say I have to say that it

377
00:13:43,270 --> 00:13:40,940
is sort of a chestnut in all just not in

378
00:13:44,950 --> 00:13:43,280
astronomy that God put all the

379
00:13:47,500 --> 00:13:44,960
interesting astronomy in the southern

380
00:13:49,120 --> 00:13:47,510
hemisphere and all the astronomers in

381
00:13:51,700 --> 00:13:49,130
the northern hemisphere now of course

382
00:13:53,230 --> 00:13:51,710
this is kind of ignores the astronomers

383
00:13:55,330 --> 00:13:53,240
in Australia and South African plays

384
00:13:56,470 --> 00:13:55,340
like that by but it must be said there

385
00:13:57,880 --> 00:13:56,480
is some truth in that because if you

386
00:14:00,100 --> 00:13:57,890
want to for example study the center of

387
00:14:01,510 --> 00:14:00,110
our galaxy that's not so easily seen

388
00:14:03,340 --> 00:14:01,520
from the north it only barely edges

389
00:14:05,230 --> 00:14:03,350
above the horizon most parts of the

390
00:14:07,650 --> 00:14:05,240
United States where is in Australia you

391
00:14:10,240 --> 00:14:07,660
can see that all the time yes there so

392
00:14:13,030 --> 00:14:10,250
you know that and that's a of course a

393
00:14:15,430 --> 00:14:13,040
very interesting place the center of our

394
00:14:17,500 --> 00:14:15,440
galaxy so you know they're just a lot of

395
00:14:19,210 --> 00:14:17,510
astronomical objects that you have in

396
00:14:20,890 --> 00:14:19,220
the southern hemisphere the Magellanic

397
00:14:23,080 --> 00:14:20,900
Clouds for example the nearest galaxies

398
00:14:24,820 --> 00:14:23,090
to our own yeah here in the south yeah

399
00:14:26,770 --> 00:14:24,830
and they're visible with the naked eye

400
00:14:27,950 --> 00:14:26,780
because most Australians I would hope I

401
00:14:29,750 --> 00:14:27,960
would certainly hope

402
00:14:32,120 --> 00:14:29,760
familiar of the Magellanic Clouds and

403
00:14:34,010 --> 00:14:32,130
faint but visible yeah well if you

404
00:14:36,050 --> 00:14:34,020
Gellin could could see them yeah then I

405
00:14:38,810 --> 00:14:36,060
would hope it the average resident of

406
00:14:40,850 --> 00:14:38,820
Penrith could see them yeah you do see

407
00:14:42,110 --> 00:14:40,860
him from melbourne on a clear night from

408
00:14:43,910 --> 00:14:42,120
the middle of melbourne it's elvin

409
00:14:45,560 --> 00:14:43,920
really you can see the magic do you

410
00:14:47,450 --> 00:14:45,570
there what a fate the hot and make out

411
00:14:50,120 --> 00:14:47,460
if you go to the bush they're highly

412
00:14:51,680 --> 00:14:50,130
prominent yes yes I won't say they sort

413
00:14:54,170 --> 00:14:51,690
of luminous but you know you you silly

414
00:14:56,810 --> 00:14:54,180
spotting if you physically a night as to

415
00:14:58,610 --> 00:14:56,820
cloud to ever go away and after about a

416
00:15:01,010 --> 00:14:58,620
week in Australian without so those are

417
00:15:02,960 --> 00:15:01,020
louder galaxies that a lot of people

418
00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:02,970
would think that wispy clouds now of

419
00:15:07,150 --> 00:15:05,610
course in the Magellanic Clouds who

420
00:15:09,620 --> 00:15:07,160
knows who knows they could be

421
00:15:11,000 --> 00:15:09,630
intelligent life it could be I mean a

422
00:15:13,160 --> 00:15:11,010
lot of stars in the Magellanic Clouds

423
00:15:16,070 --> 00:15:13,170
they have you know tens of billions of

424
00:15:17,870 --> 00:15:16,080
stars each and so why not and in fact

425
00:15:19,280 --> 00:15:17,880
one of the experiments we did at the

426
00:15:21,190 --> 00:15:19,290
Parkes radio telescope nothing that we

427
00:15:23,630 --> 00:15:21,200
wrote up and nothing that we actually

428
00:15:24,800 --> 00:15:23,640
even told many people about it was just

429
00:15:26,450 --> 00:15:24,810
an experiment I did together with a

430
00:15:28,460 --> 00:15:26,460
fellow by the name of Ronnie kurz who is

431
00:15:31,880 --> 00:15:28,470
perhaps the most prominent astronomer in

432
00:15:33,470 --> 00:15:31,890
Australia actually no he and I actually

433
00:15:34,910 --> 00:15:33,480
looked at the center of the galaxy using

434
00:15:36,680 --> 00:15:34,920
the Parkes radio telescope hoping that

435
00:15:40,250 --> 00:15:36,690
we might find some very strong beacon

436
00:15:41,630 --> 00:15:40,260
that some enterprising civilization may

437
00:15:42,740 --> 00:15:41,640
have put their knowing that everybody

438
00:15:44,600 --> 00:15:42,750
will be looking at the center of the

439
00:15:46,970 --> 00:15:44,610
galaxy yeah we didn't see anything but

440
00:15:49,880 --> 00:15:46,980
it was a tough lob servation we only

441
00:15:52,370 --> 00:15:49,890
tried one night of course the I mean the

442
00:15:54,470 --> 00:15:52,380
segue is to talk about setting search

443
00:15:55,730 --> 00:15:54,480
for extraterrestrial intelligence how

444
00:15:57,470 --> 00:15:55,740
long have you been involved with that

445
00:15:59,930 --> 00:15:57,480
program i joined the SETI Institute

446
00:16:01,250 --> 00:15:59,940
actually in 1990 so it's been a long

447
00:16:03,110 --> 00:16:01,260
time I think that's the longest job I've

448
00:16:04,840 --> 00:16:03,120
ever had I was interested in steady even

449
00:16:08,450 --> 00:16:04,850
before that I was working in Europe

450
00:16:10,010 --> 00:16:08,460
doing radio astronomy but i did a SETI

451
00:16:12,680 --> 00:16:10,020
experiment in the netherlands together

452
00:16:14,240 --> 00:16:12,690
with Joe Carter who is at the SETI

453
00:16:16,520 --> 00:16:14,250
Institute now and heads up our city

454
00:16:17,750 --> 00:16:16,530
programs actually and she came to the

455
00:16:19,250 --> 00:16:17,760
Netherlands there for a couple of weeks

456
00:16:20,270 --> 00:16:19,260
and I said you know we could do a SETI

457
00:16:22,010 --> 00:16:20,280
experiment I know how to run the

458
00:16:23,960 --> 00:16:22,020
telescope year and we did we looked at

459
00:16:25,580 --> 00:16:23,970
in fact the center of the galaxy for

460
00:16:27,290 --> 00:16:25,590
four hours which is about the best you

461
00:16:29,490 --> 00:16:27,300
can do on any given day in the

462
00:16:33,660 --> 00:16:29,500
Netherlands

463
00:16:36,510 --> 00:16:33,670
so I mean the statement is obvious so

464
00:16:37,710 --> 00:16:36,520
far nothing no that's great people often

465
00:16:39,420 --> 00:16:37,720
ask me you know well have you found

466
00:16:40,680 --> 00:16:39,430
anything and I have to turn that around

467
00:16:42,270 --> 00:16:40,690
said you know do you think that we

468
00:16:43,830 --> 00:16:42,280
wouldn't tell you or that you wouldn't

469
00:16:45,480 --> 00:16:43,840
know if we found something I mean I

470
00:16:47,250 --> 00:16:45,490
wouldn't be here i'd be you know in

471
00:16:49,820 --> 00:16:47,260
stockholm collected collecting a prize

472
00:16:52,020 --> 00:16:49,830
he probably would you probably would um

473
00:16:53,700 --> 00:16:52,030
do you ever get the point where he is

474
00:16:55,680 --> 00:16:53,710
starting to get frustrated or is it

475
00:16:56,940 --> 00:16:55,690
something that you realize might take a

476
00:16:58,800 --> 00:16:56,950
long time you don't get frustrated

477
00:17:00,480 --> 00:16:58,810
because the experiments always changing

478
00:17:01,590 --> 00:17:00,490
if you're doing the same thing over and

479
00:17:03,840 --> 00:17:01,600
over and over again I think you would

480
00:17:05,850 --> 00:17:03,850
probably get very very bored of that I

481
00:17:07,050 --> 00:17:05,860
mean that would become tiresome to begin

482
00:17:08,309 --> 00:17:07,060
with all the really boring stuff the

483
00:17:10,260 --> 00:17:08,319
listening is it were that's all

484
00:17:11,370 --> 00:17:10,270
automated so you have to do that but the

485
00:17:13,710 --> 00:17:11,380
real point is that the technology

486
00:17:15,000 --> 00:17:13,720
changes so that the experiments every

487
00:17:16,470 --> 00:17:15,010
five years are really radically

488
00:17:18,270 --> 00:17:16,480
different in terms of their capability

489
00:17:20,610 --> 00:17:18,280
yeah but beyond that you also have

490
00:17:22,920 --> 00:17:20,620
learned more right within the next three

491
00:17:24,720 --> 00:17:22,930
years the NASA's Kepler mission is going

492
00:17:26,579 --> 00:17:24,730
to tell us what fraction of stars have

493
00:17:28,590 --> 00:17:26,589
earth like planets well when we know

494
00:17:30,180 --> 00:17:28,600
that number that's going to help in the

495
00:17:32,370 --> 00:17:30,190
search because it may turn out that a

496
00:17:34,650 --> 00:17:32,380
certain kind of star system

497
00:17:36,480 --> 00:17:34,660
preferentially has cousins of the earth

498
00:17:38,610 --> 00:17:36,490
orbiting it if we know that then we can

499
00:17:40,200 --> 00:17:38,620
target those stars so the field is

500
00:17:41,850 --> 00:17:40,210
always changing both because of this new

501
00:17:44,280 --> 00:17:41,860
knowledge and because the technology

502
00:17:45,540 --> 00:17:44,290
gets faster all the time that mean one

503
00:17:48,360 --> 00:17:45,550
of the variables in the Drake Equation

504
00:17:50,070 --> 00:17:48,370
is going to be filled in yes one is and

505
00:17:53,160 --> 00:17:50,080
and that is you know what fraction of

506
00:17:55,230 --> 00:17:53,170
planets are earth-like planets are it's

507
00:17:57,060 --> 00:17:55,240
actually n to be as the factory nuts you

508
00:17:59,550 --> 00:17:57,070
know how many planets in a planetary

509
00:18:01,050 --> 00:17:59,560
system our earth like and we don't we

510
00:18:04,450 --> 00:18:01,060
don't know what that is the others you

511
00:18:06,070 --> 00:18:04,460
are you oh I remember this

512
00:18:08,730 --> 00:18:06,080
I'm sure most of my listeners will

513
00:18:12,520 --> 00:18:08,740
remember a time where we didn't know or

514
00:18:15,340 --> 00:18:12,530
identify where any extra solar planets

515
00:18:17,020 --> 00:18:15,350
were and now I don't know even know what

516
00:18:19,780 --> 00:18:17,030
the number is yeah I don't either but

517
00:18:21,760 --> 00:18:19,790
it's in excess of 350 but but really

518
00:18:23,710 --> 00:18:21,770
that that number while impressive it's

519
00:18:25,510 --> 00:18:23,720
not so interesting what's interesting is

520
00:18:27,130 --> 00:18:25,520
to know what fraction of stars have

521
00:18:28,540 --> 00:18:27,140
planets right because you can keep

522
00:18:30,040 --> 00:18:28,550
adding planets and adding plants in any

523
00:18:33,010 --> 00:18:30,050
plans but what you really want to know

524
00:18:34,540 --> 00:18:33,020
is look our planets rare planets like

525
00:18:36,580 --> 00:18:34,550
the earth are they rare are they common

526
00:18:39,130 --> 00:18:36,590
place and that we don't know despite

527
00:18:40,900 --> 00:18:39,140
having found 350 planets none of them is

528
00:18:42,430 --> 00:18:40,910
really a cousin of the earth and the

529
00:18:44,440 --> 00:18:42,440
question is is that because they're not

530
00:18:45,790 --> 00:18:44,450
there are because simply our instruments

531
00:18:47,530 --> 00:18:45,800
are not yet capable of finding it and

532
00:18:49,240 --> 00:18:47,540
that's what's going to change thanks to

533
00:18:51,520 --> 00:18:49,250
Kepler into saying the next thousand

534
00:18:54,400 --> 00:18:51,530
days three years that's incredible yeah

535
00:18:57,430 --> 00:18:54,410
because the the information that we're

536
00:18:59,830 --> 00:18:57,440
receiving now the new knowledge things

537
00:19:02,470 --> 00:18:59,840
that completely floored me and I'm sure

538
00:19:05,620 --> 00:19:02,480
many other people the knowledge that

539
00:19:08,020 --> 00:19:05,630
there are giant gas planets orbiting

540
00:19:10,690 --> 00:19:08,030
their stars at the extremely close range

541
00:19:13,390 --> 00:19:10,700
yeah that was the first planet around an

542
00:19:16,300 --> 00:19:13,400
ordinary star that was discovered 1995

543
00:19:20,440 --> 00:19:16,310
by the two swiss astronomers 51 pegasi

544
00:19:21,610 --> 00:19:20,450
is the name of the star orbits that star

545
00:19:23,290 --> 00:19:21,620
in four and a half days weather no

546
00:19:25,450 --> 00:19:23,300
planets in our solar system that orbit

547
00:19:27,220 --> 00:19:25,460
in four and a half days mercury takes 88

548
00:19:29,170 --> 00:19:27,230
and that's the fastest so nobody was

549
00:19:31,570 --> 00:19:29,180
expecting to find a planet that orbit

550
00:19:33,370 --> 00:19:31,580
that quickly and not only that is a very

551
00:19:35,890 --> 00:19:33,380
large plan nobody expects to find very

552
00:19:37,150 --> 00:19:35,900
large planets close in on the basis of

553
00:19:38,560 --> 00:19:37,160
what we know about how planets are

554
00:19:42,130 --> 00:19:38,570
formed we expect that they will be

555
00:19:43,870 --> 00:19:42,140
formed far out far far out any the solar

556
00:19:45,330 --> 00:19:43,880
systems of their birth so how did that

557
00:19:47,470 --> 00:19:45,340
planet get to where it is and

558
00:19:50,140 --> 00:19:47,480
immediately that their additions began

559
00:19:52,210 --> 00:19:50,150
to rip out their pads and papers and

560
00:19:54,490 --> 00:19:52,220
sorry their pads and pencils and try and

561
00:19:56,500 --> 00:19:54,500
figure this out and their best guess is

562
00:19:57,760 --> 00:19:56,510
that these planets migrate inward in

563
00:19:59,650 --> 00:19:57,770
other words they're born in the

564
00:20:03,170 --> 00:19:59,660
boondocks and they move to the big city

565
00:20:05,070 --> 00:20:03,180
they slowly spiral in

566
00:20:07,050 --> 00:20:05,080
presumably they reach a point where

567
00:20:09,390 --> 00:20:07,060
they're in equilibrium or they could

568
00:20:11,670 --> 00:20:09,400
continually spiral into their son well

569
00:20:13,410 --> 00:20:11,680
it depends some of them might indeed

570
00:20:14,580 --> 00:20:13,420
despite all the way into the Sun of

571
00:20:17,010 --> 00:20:14,590
course you don't see those guys because

572
00:20:19,020 --> 00:20:17,020
they're long gone but some of them will

573
00:20:21,150 --> 00:20:19,030
be able to get into an orbit where they

574
00:20:22,140 --> 00:20:21,160
just sort of distort the star that

575
00:20:24,240 --> 00:20:22,150
they're orbiting because they're very

576
00:20:25,830 --> 00:20:24,250
close after all they distort the gas of

577
00:20:27,870 --> 00:20:25,840
the star the outer regions of that star

578
00:20:30,030 --> 00:20:27,880
in just such a way that it pulls them

579
00:20:31,560 --> 00:20:30,040
along and keeps them from spiraling in

580
00:20:33,570 --> 00:20:31,570
so it turns out that there may be some

581
00:20:35,220 --> 00:20:33,580
stable situation there where they're

582
00:20:37,980 --> 00:20:35,230
orbiting very very close without going

583
00:20:39,060 --> 00:20:37,990
all the way in especially yeah so yeah

584
00:20:41,670 --> 00:20:39,070
that's that that's a completely

585
00:20:43,110 --> 00:20:41,680
unexpected sort of thing dozen years ago

586
00:20:45,510 --> 00:20:43,120
nobody would have you know consider this

587
00:20:47,900 --> 00:20:45,520
an interesting question to ask would

588
00:20:51,450 --> 00:20:47,910
this be possible but there must be a

589
00:20:53,160 --> 00:20:51,460
mazing very variation in solar systems

590
00:20:55,620 --> 00:20:53,170
ranging from gas giants in the middle

591
00:20:57,810 --> 00:20:55,630
near the Sun all the way up to cooter

592
00:20:59,220 --> 00:20:57,820
like planets new extremes we don't know

593
00:21:02,250 --> 00:20:59,230
what average solar systems look like

594
00:21:05,070 --> 00:21:02,260
yeah yeah and and you know obviously we

595
00:21:07,260 --> 00:21:05,080
assumed on the basis of the one example

596
00:21:09,630 --> 00:21:07,270
we had naming our own solar system that

597
00:21:11,280 --> 00:21:09,640
everybody else's solar system would be

598
00:21:12,570 --> 00:21:11,290
sort of like ours little rocky planets

599
00:21:14,370 --> 00:21:12,580
on the inside big gas giants on the

600
00:21:16,500 --> 00:21:14,380
outside and that's just sort of assuming

601
00:21:18,690 --> 00:21:16,510
that as i did when i was a kid that

602
00:21:20,400 --> 00:21:18,700
everybody's mom had a mom who could

603
00:21:22,950 --> 00:21:20,410
everybody's mom cooked the way my mom

604
00:21:25,680 --> 00:21:22,960
did I just assumed that then I grew up

605
00:21:29,340 --> 00:21:25,690
and I found that wasn't true to my

606
00:21:30,870 --> 00:21:29,350
disappointment I have to say but so we

607
00:21:33,120 --> 00:21:30,880
assume that other solar systems are like

608
00:21:35,040 --> 00:21:33,130
our own and we don't know that that's

609
00:21:37,080 --> 00:21:35,050
true or whether it's not true i mean we

610
00:21:39,750 --> 00:21:37,090
just don't know but the Kepler mission

611
00:21:41,400 --> 00:21:39,760
will help us answer that question and

612
00:21:43,500 --> 00:21:41,410
again the time scaled answered it's not

613
00:21:45,420 --> 00:21:43,510
decades or centuries this is something

614
00:21:47,520 --> 00:21:45,430
we're going to learn very quickly

615
00:21:49,830 --> 00:21:47,530
it's extraordinary form of social

616
00:21:51,990 --> 00:21:49,840
systems has been modeled and make the

617
00:21:53,970 --> 00:21:52,000
modeling at random and see what can a

618
00:21:56,010 --> 00:21:53,980
sore eyes and do millions of experiments

619
00:21:57,480 --> 00:21:56,020
in a computer and they carry out all

620
00:21:59,580 --> 00:21:57,490
shapes and sizes so they can be viewed

621
00:22:02,130 --> 00:21:59,590
planets close in all of us further out

622
00:22:03,720 --> 00:22:02,140
but the conditions for life on Earth

623
00:22:05,730 --> 00:22:03,730
have fairly restricted that we need to

624
00:22:09,360 --> 00:22:05,740
save that means to our laws of two cows

625
00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:09,370
over either Goldilocks and only when you

626
00:22:14,730 --> 00:22:12,010
get a sort of like in one particular

627
00:22:16,740 --> 00:22:14,740
zone so the number of stars already the

628
00:22:19,020 --> 00:22:16,750
planet is only one of many many factors

629
00:22:20,930 --> 00:22:19,030
of the equation we need to know how far

630
00:22:23,520 --> 00:22:20,940
they aren't how hot it is or how cold

631
00:22:26,750 --> 00:22:23,530
it's a kind of finding life and so on a

632
00:22:29,970 --> 00:22:26,760
deserve oceans or if it's a gas giant

633
00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:29,980
could he be swimming of the liquefied

634
00:22:37,710 --> 00:22:35,050
gas and so on so you sure if they have

635
00:22:40,530 --> 00:22:37,720
to have to run finger figures down a bit

636
00:22:41,730 --> 00:22:40,540
so now for the possibility of planets

637
00:22:43,650 --> 00:22:41,740
not being quite in the right place to

638
00:22:45,450 --> 00:22:43,660
support life well well that's correct

639
00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:45,460
when I say an earth-like planet of

640
00:22:49,290 --> 00:22:47,650
course what Kepler is in fact nominally

641
00:22:51,360 --> 00:22:49,300
looking for that means a planet that's

642
00:22:52,680 --> 00:22:51,370
not only the same size as Earth but

643
00:22:55,050 --> 00:22:52,690
that's located at the right distance

644
00:22:56,670 --> 00:22:55,060
from its star to be as you savor every

645
00:22:58,290 --> 00:22:56,680
trading the Goldilocks zone where it's

646
00:22:59,250 --> 00:22:58,300
not too hot not too cold you have liquid

647
00:23:02,400 --> 00:22:59,260
water and maybe you know something

648
00:23:04,920 --> 00:23:02,410
cooking up down there a lot of bizarre

649
00:23:07,890 --> 00:23:04,930
question is olu stuff about UFOs and

650
00:23:10,590 --> 00:23:07,900
extraterrestrials or so on believed I so

651
00:23:12,840 --> 00:23:10,600
some parts of society subculture all

652
00:23:14,580 --> 00:23:12,850
this and the public is aware of it it's

653
00:23:16,289 --> 00:23:14,590
in the movies and so on

654
00:23:18,450 --> 00:23:16,299
I was wondering if the public interest

655
00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:18,460
in that actually damages your calls as

656
00:23:23,250 --> 00:23:20,890
he affects getting funding for sitting

657
00:23:24,899 --> 00:23:23,260
well I don't think so I maybe I'm being

658
00:23:27,330 --> 00:23:24,909
naive but I don't honestly think so I

659
00:23:29,370 --> 00:23:27,340
get a lot of Correspondence about UFOs

660
00:23:31,409 --> 00:23:29,380
and you know people call up with a

661
00:23:33,899 --> 00:23:31,419
frequently and they also send me lots of

662
00:23:35,580 --> 00:23:33,909
email asking questions about UFOs are

663
00:23:37,649 --> 00:23:35,590
simply to tell me what they've seen or

664
00:23:39,419 --> 00:23:37,659
to send me photos and so forth I don't

665
00:23:40,620 --> 00:23:39,429
believe that these people are thinking

666
00:23:43,289 --> 00:23:40,630
I'm definitely not going to give these

667
00:23:44,700 --> 00:23:43,299
guys money because you know they don't

668
00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:44,710
think that we're being visited and I do

669
00:23:51,149 --> 00:23:49,690
I just don't see that as an issue there

670
00:23:52,649 --> 00:23:51,159
is some tension between the UFO

671
00:23:54,149 --> 00:23:52,659
community in the city community for

672
00:23:55,950 --> 00:23:54,159
reasons that are not entirely clear to

673
00:23:57,240 --> 00:23:55,960
me I mean after all in some sense we're

674
00:24:00,299 --> 00:23:57,250
both looking for extraterrestrial

675
00:24:02,100 --> 00:24:00,309
intelligence but that they've already

676
00:24:03,840 --> 00:24:02,110
found it well you see there is that

677
00:24:07,169 --> 00:24:03,850
difference they claim they've succeeded

678
00:24:08,760 --> 00:24:07,179
and we don't make that claim it but yeah

679
00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:08,770
there is some sort of emotional tension

680
00:24:12,180 --> 00:24:10,690
here but I don't I don't know that it

681
00:24:13,740 --> 00:24:12,190
hurts I honestly done a third of the

682
00:24:16,159 --> 00:24:13,750
American population and for that matter

683
00:24:18,240 --> 00:24:16,169
a third of the population of Australia

684
00:24:19,799 --> 00:24:18,250
thinks that we're being visited so it's

685
00:24:22,049 --> 00:24:19,809
not a fringe believe its main SHINee

686
00:24:23,669 --> 00:24:22,059
believe well Steve Roberts thanks for

687
00:24:26,039 --> 00:24:23,679
joining us up here today in the very

688
00:24:28,169 --> 00:24:26,049
interesting middle of the Hilton Hotel

689
00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:28,179
here in Atlanta the elevators going up

690
00:24:32,730 --> 00:24:29,890
and down with bizarre in Oliver English

691
00:24:34,529 --> 00:24:32,740
exam 50 and of course Alex seth shostack

692
00:24:36,120 --> 00:24:34,539
thank you so much for giving us your

693
00:24:47,570 --> 00:24:36,130
time today for the skeptics gentlemen

694
00:24:52,770 --> 00:24:50,640
this is desiree shell hosted skeptically

695
00:24:55,230 --> 00:24:52,780
speaking check out our website at

696
00:24:59,130 --> 00:24:55,240
skeptically speaking calm and listen to

697
00:25:02,880 --> 00:24:59,140
us live on CJ sr 88.5 FM in Edmonton

698
00:25:12,639 --> 00:25:02,890
Alberta Canada I now return you to the

699
00:25:18,139 --> 00:25:15,649
British illusionist and Mentalist Derren

700
00:25:20,119 --> 00:25:18,149
Brown recently wowed the world by

701
00:25:22,430 --> 00:25:20,129
seeming to predict the winning lotto

702
00:25:25,459 --> 00:25:22,440
numbers this caused a great deal of

703
00:25:28,939 --> 00:25:25,469
media commentary and I was asked to give

704
00:25:35,039 --> 00:25:28,949
my thoughts on Sydney radio to UE with

705
00:25:40,720 --> 00:25:38,259
last week on the program under Brady who

706
00:25:44,289 --> 00:25:40,730
gives us the UK report later on in the

707
00:25:47,859 --> 00:25:44,299
show told us about a British illusionist

708
00:25:49,299 --> 00:25:47,869
Derren Brown who left viewers in Britain

709
00:25:50,560 --> 00:25:49,309
scratching their heads after he appeared

710
00:25:53,259 --> 00:25:50,570
to have correctly predicted the six

711
00:25:54,639 --> 00:25:53,269
winning numbers in the UK's televised

712
00:25:58,570 --> 00:25:54,649
lottery draw now it was quite an amazing

713
00:26:00,220 --> 00:25:58,580
story after leaving viewers in suspense

714
00:26:02,109 --> 00:26:00,230
as to Halloway actually did it he

715
00:26:04,119 --> 00:26:02,119
finally revealed all overnight in a

716
00:26:05,879 --> 00:26:04,129
ratings bonanza apparently which drew in

717
00:26:08,649 --> 00:26:05,889
more than four and a half million people

718
00:26:10,090 --> 00:26:08,659
called how to win the lottery well of

719
00:26:11,259 --> 00:26:10,100
course you'd be watching naturally

720
00:26:13,060 --> 00:26:11,269
enough because everyone wanted to find

721
00:26:14,739 --> 00:26:13,070
out how to win the lottery so here we've

722
00:26:18,340 --> 00:26:14,749
got this blokey and he is an illusionist

723
00:26:20,350 --> 00:26:18,350
Derren Brown who well to all intents and

724
00:26:24,730 --> 00:26:20,360
purposes correctly predicted the six

725
00:26:26,320 --> 00:26:24,740
winning numbers in a UK lottery draw he

726
00:26:27,580 --> 00:26:26,330
stated now this is darren brown he

727
00:26:29,470 --> 00:26:27,590
stated that the correct numbers were

728
00:26:33,009 --> 00:26:29,480
chosen by a combination of quote deep

729
00:26:35,499 --> 00:26:33,019
maths and averaging out the subconscious

730
00:26:37,960 --> 00:26:35,509
predictions of 24 people a method

731
00:26:39,879 --> 00:26:37,970
inspired by an Old Country Fair trick

732
00:26:42,190 --> 00:26:39,889
this was his interpretation of it all

733
00:26:43,749 --> 00:26:42,200
sounds rather fabulous doesn't it he

734
00:26:45,430 --> 00:26:43,759
claimed that the trick tells how a crowd

735
00:26:47,769 --> 00:26:45,440
of people at a country fair accurately

736
00:26:52,060 --> 00:26:47,779
estimated the weight of an ox when their

737
00:26:54,129 --> 00:26:52,070
guesses were all averaged out yeah okay

738
00:26:55,450 --> 00:26:54,139
but of course needless to say many

739
00:26:57,669 --> 00:26:55,460
people aren't buying the explanation

740
00:26:59,619 --> 00:26:57,679
mathematicians of dismisses explanation

741
00:27:01,659 --> 00:26:59,629
is absolute complete nutter rubbish

742
00:27:03,159 --> 00:27:01,669
absolutely completely nonsense so I

743
00:27:05,350 --> 00:27:03,169
thought that I'd go to the bloke that I

744
00:27:08,019 --> 00:27:05,360
always turn to in situations like this

745
00:27:09,730 --> 00:27:08,029
who always has an answer for all of this

746
00:27:10,749 --> 00:27:09,740
and well he's a bit of a skeptic at

747
00:27:12,730 --> 00:27:10,759
heart because he is the vice president

748
00:27:15,129 --> 00:27:12,740
of the Australia skeptics Association

749
00:27:16,450 --> 00:27:15,139
Richard Saunders good evening hey gland

750
00:27:17,739 --> 00:27:16,460
good evening hi might this would be

751
00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:17,749
right up your alley you'd love this one

752
00:27:22,149 --> 00:27:19,490
I loved it i thought it was

753
00:27:25,359 --> 00:27:22,159
fantastically good fun and the way that

754
00:27:27,129 --> 00:27:25,369
the media and the television stations

755
00:27:29,049 --> 00:27:27,139
were reporting you know something in

756
00:27:32,409 --> 00:27:29,059
britain even here in australia really

757
00:27:35,350 --> 00:27:32,419
knocked my socks off so all marks Derren

758
00:27:37,299 --> 00:27:35,360
Brown for pulling off what he wanted to

759
00:27:40,389 --> 00:27:37,309
do which was to get attention and have

760
00:27:43,509 --> 00:27:40,399
an amusing and entertaining spot on the

761
00:27:46,180 --> 00:27:43,519
TV and look I watched her tonight on I

762
00:27:48,100 --> 00:27:46,190
think it was on today tonight they

763
00:27:51,430 --> 00:27:48,110
showed they showed part of

764
00:27:52,570 --> 00:27:51,440
his how to win the lottery show which

765
00:27:53,799 --> 00:27:52,580
drew an audience of four and a half

766
00:27:55,000 --> 00:27:53,809
million people which in itself is

767
00:27:56,590 --> 00:27:55,010
outstanding but of course that just

768
00:28:00,370 --> 00:27:56,600
proves one thing we all want to win talk

769
00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:00,380
tree but in in the little bit of a

770
00:28:06,039 --> 00:28:03,170
snippet that they showed he appeared to

771
00:28:08,049 --> 00:28:06,049
me to actually almost be taking the piss

772
00:28:09,490 --> 00:28:08,059
out of himself I mean he almost owned up

773
00:28:13,360 --> 00:28:09,500
to the fact that this is an illusion

774
00:28:16,030 --> 00:28:13,370
well instead when you were introducing

775
00:28:19,120 --> 00:28:16,040
the segment in the story that's what he

776
00:28:21,419 --> 00:28:19,130
is he's an illusionist when he pulls up

777
00:28:25,720 --> 00:28:21,429
the amazingly impossible ii astonishing

778
00:28:28,960 --> 00:28:25,730
people all automatically forget for some

779
00:28:32,650 --> 00:28:28,970
reason that it an illusion a trick akan

780
00:28:34,030 --> 00:28:32,660
where icon is a bit too heavy when when

781
00:28:35,830 --> 00:28:34,040
David Copperfield or another great

782
00:28:38,740 --> 00:28:35,840
magician saws the lady in half or

783
00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:38,750
applies across the stage we all know

784
00:28:44,140 --> 00:28:42,530
it's a very very very clever trick so

785
00:28:46,600 --> 00:28:44,150
when darren brown does something where

786
00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:46,610
he appears to manipulate people's minds

787
00:28:52,360 --> 00:28:49,130
or behaviors or actions or predict the

788
00:28:53,890 --> 00:28:52,370
winning lotto numbers please be

789
00:28:56,710 --> 00:28:53,900
entertained by it have your socks

790
00:28:57,970 --> 00:28:56,720
knocked off but it's a trick did I get

791
00:28:59,620 --> 00:28:57,980
too carried away don't get too carried

792
00:29:01,240 --> 00:28:59,630
away because you know you guys and girls

793
00:29:02,530 --> 00:29:01,250
with the Australian skeptics you you

794
00:29:05,470 --> 00:29:02,540
love all of this sort of stuff and

795
00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:05,480
particularly you love the the people who

796
00:29:10,870 --> 00:29:07,130
do take themselves seriously and who

797
00:29:12,159 --> 00:29:10,880
purport to be able to do all these

798
00:29:13,570 --> 00:29:12,169
wondrous things which you have

799
00:29:16,299 --> 00:29:13,580
absolutely no scientific basis

800
00:29:18,820 --> 00:29:16,309
whatsoever well it comes back to the

801
00:29:21,280 --> 00:29:18,830
fact that magic or the profession of

802
00:29:23,980 --> 00:29:21,290
conjuring as it's really known is a very

803
00:29:27,310 --> 00:29:23,990
ancient and Noble and respected and

804
00:29:29,710 --> 00:29:27,320
decent part for the idea is to fool you

805
00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:29,720
to trick you and ultimately to give you

806
00:29:34,299 --> 00:29:32,210
a great night entertainment and leave

807
00:29:38,770 --> 00:29:34,309
you wondering or a scratching your head

808
00:29:42,060 --> 00:29:38,780
but they don't ever say by the way I

809
00:29:44,799 --> 00:29:42,070
really am making the woman fly or I

810
00:29:46,990 --> 00:29:44,809
really am defying the laws of physics by

811
00:29:49,090 --> 00:29:47,000
sawing this woman and half a day I me to

812
00:29:52,390 --> 00:29:49,100
astonish you and amaze you and I hope

813
00:29:55,360 --> 00:29:52,400
you all equally have a great time where

814
00:29:57,130 --> 00:29:55,370
we what we find is very sad is some

815
00:29:59,230 --> 00:29:57,140
people who have learned very interesting

816
00:30:01,400 --> 00:29:59,240
and skillful magic tricks will then go

817
00:30:03,500 --> 00:30:01,410
and say by the way I really

818
00:30:05,270 --> 00:30:03,510
doing this you know it does this isn't a

819
00:30:07,250 --> 00:30:05,280
trick I'm doing this by some strange

820
00:30:09,380 --> 00:30:07,260
magical powers which science hasn't

821
00:30:12,050 --> 00:30:09,390
caught up with and the magicians in the

822
00:30:14,210 --> 00:30:12,060
skeptics say oh come on why you spoiling

823
00:30:15,740 --> 00:30:14,220
it for everybody else this is a noble

824
00:30:18,020 --> 00:30:15,750
art you shouldn't be doing this with him

825
00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:18,030
and yet there would be plenty of people

826
00:30:23,660 --> 00:30:20,010
who would have watched that who I assume

827
00:30:26,270 --> 00:30:23,670
would go away thinking it really

828
00:30:28,550 --> 00:30:26,280
happened well I that's all very well

829
00:30:31,100 --> 00:30:28,560
that's fine maybe that's part of the fun

830
00:30:33,590 --> 00:30:31,110
in the magic of it if they get back to

831
00:30:36,290 --> 00:30:33,600
the basics and again it all in all in

832
00:30:38,900 --> 00:30:36,300
what he is he is an illusionist it's an

833
00:30:40,550 --> 00:30:38,910
illusion I guess you can't convince some

834
00:30:42,980 --> 00:30:40,560
people because a good illusion that

835
00:30:45,350 --> 00:30:42,990
looks real that's the whole amount of a

836
00:30:47,450 --> 00:30:45,360
good magic trick you have to it almost

837
00:30:48,770 --> 00:30:47,460
sucks you in and there's a part of your

838
00:30:50,060 --> 00:30:48,780
brain that always has to remember oh

839
00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:50,070
it's a drink it's a trick that they've

840
00:30:54,020 --> 00:30:52,170
worked the ears to make to make it look

841
00:30:56,750 --> 00:30:54,030
like that it's really happen tell what

842
00:30:58,400 --> 00:30:56,760
you've done this i watch it a couple of

843
00:31:00,620 --> 00:30:58,410
times actually and I've studied it very

844
00:31:03,410 --> 00:31:00,630
carefully I don't know the exact

845
00:31:05,570 --> 00:31:03,420
mechanisms that he employed and I don't

846
00:31:07,520 --> 00:31:05,580
know if I want to even if I did I mean I

847
00:31:09,530 --> 00:31:07,530
must queste well would it be right if I

848
00:31:11,630 --> 00:31:09,540
blabbed a trick you know to for the

849
00:31:14,930 --> 00:31:11,640
world to know I think it's got something

850
00:31:17,540 --> 00:31:14,940
to do with a probably ultimately camera

851
00:31:19,220 --> 00:31:17,550
trickery in the end but is that the

852
00:31:21,110 --> 00:31:19,230
important thing as long as people were

853
00:31:23,030 --> 00:31:21,120
entertained and as long as they don't

854
00:31:25,280 --> 00:31:23,040
take it too seriously I think that's

855
00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:25,290
more important I think you're right so

856
00:31:29,150 --> 00:31:27,690
in other words when his final program on

857
00:31:30,590 --> 00:31:29,160
the topic of how to bring down a casino

858
00:31:32,480 --> 00:31:30,600
goes to where we shouldn't worry too

859
00:31:34,340 --> 00:31:32,490
much about watching that's how we can go

860
00:31:36,500 --> 00:31:34,350
and close down Star City yeah I don't

861
00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:36,510
think so and if you really could predict

862
00:31:40,220 --> 00:31:38,010
the winning lotto numbers that would be

863
00:31:43,460 --> 00:31:40,230
the end of lotto in this country in all

864
00:31:44,870 --> 00:31:43,470
countries it would just be so spooky our

865
00:31:46,460 --> 00:31:44,880
world out there Richard isn't it it's

866
00:31:48,110 --> 00:31:46,470
good but it's good fun play good on you

867
00:31:49,640 --> 00:31:48,120
Michael talking into more I hope they're

868
00:31:52,010 --> 00:31:49,650
thanks might find out Richard Saunders

869
00:31:54,140 --> 00:31:52,020
there from the Australian skeptics going

870
00:31:56,600 --> 00:31:54,150
where no man has gone before that's not

871
00:31:58,130 --> 00:31:56,610
true actually Richard and his crew were

872
00:31:59,900 --> 00:31:58,140
just fabulous of being able to look at

873
00:32:01,880 --> 00:31:59,910
some of these things and it's very

874
00:32:04,160 --> 00:32:01,890
simply just to break it all down so that

875
00:32:07,340 --> 00:32:04,170
it's not quite as you like mystical and

876
00:32:09,250 --> 00:32:07,350
amazing is it my first seem I could

877
00:32:11,530 --> 00:32:09,260
somebody actually just pick the winner

878
00:32:25,890 --> 00:32:11,540
lotto numbers like that not that simple

879
00:32:30,130 --> 00:32:28,240
astronomy cast who takes a fact space

880
00:32:32,020 --> 00:32:30,140
journey through the cosmos as it offers

881
00:32:34,690 --> 00:32:32,030
listeners weekly discussions on

882
00:32:37,630 --> 00:32:34,700
astronomical topics ranging from planets

883
00:32:40,060 --> 00:32:37,640
to cosmology hosted by Fraser Cain of

884
00:32:40,930 --> 00:32:40,070
Universe Today and myself dr. Pamela gay

885
00:32:43,600 --> 00:32:40,940
of southern illinois university

886
00:32:45,460 --> 00:32:43,610
edwardsville this show brings the

887
00:32:47,890 --> 00:32:45,470
questions of an avid astronomy lover

888
00:32:49,990 --> 00:32:47,900
directly to an astronomer together

889
00:32:51,520 --> 00:32:50,000
Fraser and I explore what is known and

890
00:32:54,280 --> 00:32:51,530
being discovered about the universe

891
00:32:56,380 --> 00:32:54,290
around us join us each week as we take a

892
00:33:05,800 --> 00:32:56,390
fact space journey through the cosmos at

893
00:33:13,050 --> 00:33:05,810
astronomy cast com join us now for

894
00:33:17,860 --> 00:33:16,060
I'm Carly Sturgis and on the tenth of

895
00:33:20,170 --> 00:33:17,870
September on the way back from dragoncon

896
00:33:22,300 --> 00:33:20,180
I was honored to be invited to speak at

897
00:33:25,390 --> 00:33:22,310
the very first skeptics in the pub in

898
00:33:27,310 --> 00:33:25,400
Auckland New Zealand out of the 50 or so

899
00:33:29,530 --> 00:33:27,320
who attended a group helped out with an

900
00:33:31,660 --> 00:33:29,540
impromptu think tank in the courtyard of

901
00:33:34,570 --> 00:33:31,670
the horse and trap a lovely pub in the

902
00:33:36,760 --> 00:33:34,580
suburb of Mount Eden the very first

903
00:33:39,320 --> 00:33:36,770
skeptics in the pub in Auckland say

904
00:33:41,700 --> 00:33:39,330
hello Oakland

905
00:33:45,180 --> 00:33:41,710
so how many people did we end up getting

906
00:33:47,610 --> 00:33:45,190
do you think em over 40 / 40 people and

907
00:33:49,140 --> 00:33:47,620
you are a michael patrick you Mike

908
00:33:51,690 --> 00:33:49,150
you're Patrick or I can hear something

909
00:33:53,520 --> 00:33:51,700
coming fast so cute hugs me feeling me I

910
00:33:54,660 --> 00:33:53,530
can meet the train station of all the

911
00:33:56,640 --> 00:33:54,670
pubs we had to go we had to go to the

912
00:33:59,100 --> 00:33:56,650
one with a train station the name and

913
00:34:00,330 --> 00:33:59,110
skeptics owners got and the bus

914
00:34:02,370 --> 00:34:00,340
announcements we've got actual

915
00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:02,380
transforming works well done auckland

916
00:34:07,410 --> 00:34:04,090
another thing that Aucklanders managed

917
00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:07,420
to get going is a couple of ideas and

918
00:34:11,040 --> 00:34:09,490
people tend to get in the pub which is a

919
00:34:12,810 --> 00:34:11,050
good thing because then that's part of

920
00:34:15,600 --> 00:34:12,820
the point of being here and once a month

921
00:34:18,120 --> 00:34:15,610
meetings and but I think one of the good

922
00:34:19,830 --> 00:34:18,130
things is them as positive message

923
00:34:21,870 --> 00:34:19,840
skepticism needs to be positive m

924
00:34:23,850 --> 00:34:21,880
education is more effective than

925
00:34:28,230 --> 00:34:23,860
criticism although i do like curses are

926
00:34:29,730 --> 00:34:28,240
sizing myself so um no modi culture

927
00:34:34,020 --> 00:34:29,740
bashing please and there are other

928
00:34:36,570 --> 00:34:34,030
assistive focusin and the idea of having

929
00:34:38,850 --> 00:34:36,580
speakers having a talk every time me 20

930
00:34:42,720 --> 00:34:38,860
minutes la flair then I discussion and

931
00:34:45,389 --> 00:34:42,730
to invite plenty speakers along and yeah

932
00:34:49,110 --> 00:34:45,399
I think that's that's once a month hub

933
00:34:50,760 --> 00:34:49,120
is good yes and so puppies good what

934
00:34:52,590 --> 00:34:50,770
some of the big issues that haven't bled

935
00:34:55,889 --> 00:34:52,600
these people here and I've got about all

936
00:34:58,770 --> 00:34:55,899
let me see 2 4 6 8 0 about maybe nearly

937
00:35:00,060 --> 00:34:58,780
15 of us what led you to come here

938
00:35:02,040 --> 00:35:00,070
because I think there's something that

939
00:35:03,330 --> 00:35:02,050
needs to be heard anyone want to

940
00:35:06,150 --> 00:35:03,340
volunteer one of the things that said

941
00:35:08,130 --> 00:35:06,160
was no married culture bashing that

942
00:35:09,510 --> 00:35:08,140
intrigues me I think one of the main

943
00:35:11,700 --> 00:35:09,520
reasons a lot of people came here is

944
00:35:15,120 --> 00:35:11,710
because of the recent court case where

945
00:35:16,380 --> 00:35:15,130
Janet Moses young Mary lady was killed

946
00:35:18,140 --> 00:35:16,390
by a group of people who honestly

947
00:35:21,430 --> 00:35:18,150
believe they were performing an exorcism

948
00:35:22,990 --> 00:35:21,440
so they say she basically drowns and

949
00:35:24,579 --> 00:35:23,000
her own living room because they were

950
00:35:28,450 --> 00:35:24,589
pouring water down her mouth and into

951
00:35:31,329 --> 00:35:28,460
our eyeballs and she died and they got

952
00:35:33,460 --> 00:35:31,339
300 hours community service as the

953
00:35:34,540 --> 00:35:33,470
penalties on no jail time and they're

954
00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:34,550
not allowed out of the houses between

955
00:35:37,510 --> 00:35:36,170
six at night and nine in the morning

956
00:35:39,370 --> 00:35:37,520
that's their punishment for killing this

957
00:35:41,440 --> 00:35:39,380
young lady and they are basically lost

958
00:35:43,349 --> 00:35:41,450
because they honestly believed that they

959
00:35:47,380 --> 00:35:43,359
were doing the right thing which is

960
00:35:48,430 --> 00:35:47,390
removing a ghost lady what about some of

961
00:35:50,200 --> 00:35:48,440
the things that you feel like you could

962
00:35:51,460 --> 00:35:50,210
have a control over things that you can

963
00:35:52,599 --> 00:35:51,470
have a sale but what are some of the big

964
00:35:54,430 --> 00:35:52,609
things that you think if I just had a

965
00:35:56,349 --> 00:35:54,440
few more people or a few more voices or

966
00:36:00,250 --> 00:35:56,359
or maybe a couple of tactics I could do

967
00:36:03,370 --> 00:36:00,260
something about X what is X the other

968
00:36:06,099 --> 00:36:03,380
day was there's a displaced end of the

969
00:36:08,290 --> 00:36:06,109
mall for a chiropractic company that's

970
00:36:09,940 --> 00:36:08,300
in that's in the area I grabbed a couple

971
00:36:13,780 --> 00:36:09,950
of their flyers I've actually scanned

972
00:36:15,790 --> 00:36:13,790
them I was going to look for an expert

973
00:36:18,460 --> 00:36:15,800
opinion to see if there's something we

974
00:36:20,680 --> 00:36:18,470
can something actionable that they've

975
00:36:23,410 --> 00:36:20,690
said on the flyers and on their run on

976
00:36:26,190 --> 00:36:23,420
their materials whether that's something

977
00:36:29,170 --> 00:36:26,200
that we can send to some sort of a

978
00:36:31,450 --> 00:36:29,180
whoever's in charge of advertising I

979
00:36:34,329 --> 00:36:31,460
guess to say look they're saying this

980
00:36:35,920 --> 00:36:34,339
and here's what the actual vector and

981
00:36:38,349 --> 00:36:35,930
that's something that's just come up

982
00:36:40,910 --> 00:36:38,359
because of course um Simon soon and the

983
00:36:45,750 --> 00:36:43,770
yeah that's something that I'm trying to

984
00:36:49,560 --> 00:36:45,760
do is I keep an eye out for things that

985
00:36:53,040 --> 00:36:49,570
I can great they're material and say

986
00:36:55,680 --> 00:36:53,050
here you know this is wrong someone

987
00:36:57,390 --> 00:36:55,690
should know that complain about it and

988
00:36:59,820 --> 00:36:57,400
so what we have here is some concerns

989
00:37:01,440 --> 00:36:59,830
which seem to be universal you're

990
00:37:03,720 --> 00:37:01,450
hearing about other countries other

991
00:37:05,910 --> 00:37:03,730
other authors you mentioned Simon Singh

992
00:37:09,510 --> 00:37:05,920
standing up and then saying not this

993
00:37:13,170 --> 00:37:09,520
isn't on ya goes unchallenged in New

994
00:37:15,270 --> 00:37:13,180
Zealand there's I don't think there is a

995
00:37:17,570 --> 00:37:15,280
new zealand skeptic scripts but I see

996
00:37:20,250 --> 00:37:17,580
Bale all of it and in the media windows

997
00:37:23,400 --> 00:37:20,260
and pseudoscience and when there's

998
00:37:25,200 --> 00:37:23,410
things that you know things are at and

999
00:37:28,290 --> 00:37:25,210
pseudoscientific that there is no

1000
00:37:31,980 --> 00:37:28,300
pushback part of my desire to get people

1001
00:37:33,240 --> 00:37:31,990
here was was trying you know try find

1002
00:37:35,280 --> 00:37:33,250
out if there was enough people in

1003
00:37:36,810 --> 00:37:35,290
Auckland who actually want a traditional

1004
00:37:39,030 --> 00:37:36,820
available to go off the common actually

1005
00:37:40,800 --> 00:37:39,040
come to me to start with but I said to

1006
00:37:43,140 --> 00:37:40,810
start that push back just to see it

1007
00:37:46,440 --> 00:37:43,150
snorky for John Edwards to come and rip

1008
00:37:48,240 --> 00:37:46,450
people off the tuna flavor is 100 bucks

1009
00:37:50,070 --> 00:37:48,250
and he's doing at the moment isn't he

1010
00:37:51,510 --> 00:37:50,080
his comets come to New Zealand and and

1011
00:37:53,670 --> 00:37:51,520
and he's not the only psychic New

1012
00:37:56,550 --> 00:37:53,680
Zealand we have a real ass TV show

1013
00:37:58,500 --> 00:37:56,560
called sensing murder oh yes whenever we

1014
00:38:00,960 --> 00:37:58,510
get mail from New Zealand it's about

1015
00:38:03,480 --> 00:38:00,970
sensing murder I can see people nodding

1016
00:38:06,300 --> 00:38:03,490
I want a Qantas media world a couple

1017
00:38:09,270 --> 00:38:06,310
years back for for best program and all

1018
00:38:10,530 --> 00:38:09,280
you're kidding won an award and that's

1019
00:38:12,900 --> 00:38:10,540
kind of thing that really gets me and

1020
00:38:14,490 --> 00:38:12,910
and there was no it wasn't there's no

1021
00:38:16,230 --> 00:38:14,500
letter in the newspaper that says we

1022
00:38:17,550 --> 00:38:16,240
find this important because was there

1023
00:38:19,200 --> 00:38:17,560
just ripping people off there was

1024
00:38:20,880 --> 00:38:19,210
nothing like that and that's what kind

1025
00:38:23,920 --> 00:38:20,890
of really kind of disappointed being

1026
00:38:25,540 --> 00:38:23,930
part of the reason why I hope that

1027
00:38:27,940 --> 00:38:25,550
enough people not going to get some in

1028
00:38:30,520 --> 00:38:27,950
together I don't think it's big issues

1029
00:38:33,370 --> 00:38:30,530
well there are but what's not that's not

1030
00:38:36,400 --> 00:38:33,380
it's just gently nibble away on a crap

1031
00:38:38,320 --> 00:38:36,410
that you see in the TV it's skeptics in

1032
00:38:40,930 --> 00:38:38,330
Oakland we need all crap is that gonna

1033
00:38:43,750 --> 00:38:40,940
be able crap mean the boy away crap I

1034
00:38:46,180 --> 00:38:43,760
think the best did I just you're right

1035
00:38:48,460 --> 00:38:46,190
the newspaper funda stupid bloody top

1036
00:38:51,370 --> 00:38:48,470
back shows and say well I was a pilot

1037
00:38:53,710 --> 00:38:51,380
wasn't it you know just to say where do

1038
00:38:57,040 --> 00:38:53,720
you where do you come up with this

1039
00:38:59,590 --> 00:38:57,050
nonsense you know proved to me that this

1040
00:39:02,860 --> 00:38:59,600
works by the bengal their journeys and

1041
00:39:03,970 --> 00:39:02,870
his teach these t-shirts it says thing

1042
00:39:07,090 --> 00:39:03,980
you'll find it's a bit more complicated

1043
00:39:09,250 --> 00:39:07,100
than that because everybody wants

1044
00:39:11,380 --> 00:39:09,260
ten-second answers to questions that

1045
00:39:14,530 --> 00:39:11,390
have taken millennia to try and solve it

1046
00:39:17,590 --> 00:39:14,540
says it's the classic fairy setting news

1047
00:39:20,110 --> 00:39:17,600
bite yeah and it just doesn't exist what

1048
00:39:21,730 --> 00:39:20,120
other things make you oh here we go well

1049
00:39:24,610 --> 00:39:21,740
it didn't actually intend to contribute

1050
00:39:27,190 --> 00:39:24,620
but two of the things have already sort

1051
00:39:29,080 --> 00:39:27,200
of been my personal bugbears and one of

1052
00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:29,090
them was the marketer case that probably

1053
00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:30,650
for the opposite reason to the one

1054
00:39:35,350 --> 00:39:33,170
suggested because somebody blogged about

1055
00:39:37,030 --> 00:39:35,360
that on the on the website will actually

1056
00:39:38,830 --> 00:39:37,040
bought the actual sentencing decision

1057
00:39:40,780 --> 00:39:38,840
and gave it to that person because i

1058
00:39:42,250 --> 00:39:40,790
think if you obviously if you have a

1059
00:39:43,840 --> 00:39:42,260
view you need to be informed about the

1060
00:39:46,030 --> 00:39:43,850
sex and the reason people aren't

1061
00:39:48,490 --> 00:39:46,040
informed is because of media and that's

1062
00:39:51,640 --> 00:39:48,500
my one of my big bug bears because i

1063
00:39:54,250 --> 00:39:51,650
think they bear a lot of the blame in

1064
00:39:56,830 --> 00:39:54,260
terms of what everybody said I guess

1065
00:39:59,680 --> 00:39:56,840
substantively and I've got a celica Luna

1066
00:40:03,120 --> 00:39:59,690
and substantively and procedurally

1067
00:40:05,830 --> 00:40:03,130
because firstly they report crap

1068
00:40:08,200 --> 00:40:05,840
inaccurate stuff most of the time but

1069
00:40:10,030 --> 00:40:08,210
also they are the means by which most of

1070
00:40:12,640 --> 00:40:10,040
everybody else's rubbish as sort of

1071
00:40:16,600 --> 00:40:12,650
spread throughout the community and they

1072
00:40:19,030 --> 00:40:16,610
don't challenge ever well almost never

1073
00:40:21,130 --> 00:40:19,040
you Hadley viously great journalism in

1074
00:40:23,500 --> 00:40:21,140
New Zealand that really challenges bad

1075
00:40:26,860 --> 00:40:23,510
beliefs and dodgy ideas and that's my

1076
00:40:29,950 --> 00:40:26,870
personal on a daily basis I think right

1077
00:40:31,630 --> 00:40:29,960
there was a story about how Antarctica

1078
00:40:34,060 --> 00:40:31,640
is melting or something like that and

1079
00:40:36,370 --> 00:40:34,070
you're driving don't big drill

1080
00:40:38,410 --> 00:40:36,380
to get ancient water and what they're

1081
00:40:42,610 --> 00:40:38,420
showing your TV a bloody Paulo be a

1082
00:40:45,820 --> 00:40:42,620
falling off a nice for what it is right

1083
00:40:48,610 --> 00:40:45,830
this rubbish have no processes

1084
00:40:51,880 --> 00:40:48,620
whatsoever so one goal could be said is

1085
00:40:54,130 --> 00:40:51,890
to get in touch with journalists get in

1086
00:40:56,410 --> 00:40:54,140
touch with the media have a voice there

1087
00:40:58,810 --> 00:40:56,420
be represented va a contact point for

1088
00:41:02,410 --> 00:40:58,820
them the Auckland skeptics could be one

1089
00:41:03,640 --> 00:41:02,420
perhaps do you think of you yeah

1090
00:41:05,530 --> 00:41:03,650
unfortunately I'm putting herself in

1091
00:41:09,070 --> 00:41:05,540
Georgia position I am a journalist I'm

1092
00:41:10,570 --> 00:41:09,080
teens that's it he has to leave now the

1093
00:41:12,940 --> 00:41:10,580
one the one thing about journalism is

1094
00:41:15,520 --> 00:41:12,950
its in green that journalism needs

1095
00:41:18,100 --> 00:41:15,530
balance and that's that's fine where

1096
00:41:19,900 --> 00:41:18,110
there's two equally dissenting sides to

1097
00:41:22,120 --> 00:41:19,910
the story yeah unfortunately science

1098
00:41:24,550 --> 00:41:22,130
doesn't work like that and but because

1099
00:41:26,380 --> 00:41:24,560
bounce is ingrained and people expect

1100
00:41:29,200 --> 00:41:26,390
bounce in their new stories it means

1101
00:41:31,270 --> 00:41:29,210
that for every scientific pieces written

1102
00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:31,280
there has to be the response at

1103
00:41:35,830 --> 00:41:33,410
the end which is someone who says that

1104
00:41:37,000 --> 00:41:35,840
actually it's not true and you know you

1105
00:41:38,770 --> 00:41:37,010
don't have to spend thousands and

1106
00:41:39,880 --> 00:41:38,780
pharmaceuticals because the plant in

1107
00:41:43,050 --> 00:41:39,890
your garden is going to cure your cancer

1108
00:41:45,700 --> 00:41:43,060
and and unfortunately that's just we and

1109
00:41:49,030 --> 00:41:45,710
journalism is the good thing of course

1110
00:41:50,770 --> 00:41:49,040
is that blogs aren't new aren't

1111
00:41:53,650 --> 00:41:50,780
constrained by those journalistic

1112
00:41:56,560 --> 00:41:53,660
standards good blogs well how writes a

1113
00:41:57,790 --> 00:41:56,570
reply will and correct errors and will

1114
00:41:59,830 --> 00:41:57,800
make sure that people can understand

1115
00:42:02,590 --> 00:41:59,840
when errors with me made and are not

1116
00:42:04,930 --> 00:42:02,600
visible but they can focus in on what

1117
00:42:06,610 --> 00:42:04,940
what actual story is and point to the

1118
00:42:09,310 --> 00:42:06,620
real facts point to the papers and

1119
00:42:11,380 --> 00:42:09,320
that's something that journalists and

1120
00:42:14,170 --> 00:42:11,390
use people traditionally newspapers and

1121
00:42:17,410 --> 00:42:14,180
even online aren't able to do and that's

1122
00:42:19,480 --> 00:42:17,420
a big problem I know that channel 7 and

1123
00:42:20,830 --> 00:42:19,490
Yahoo have recently contacted the

1124
00:42:23,350 --> 00:42:20,840
Australian skeptics and allowed them

1125
00:42:25,090 --> 00:42:23,360
space for an official blog on their site

1126
00:42:26,890 --> 00:42:25,100
so possibly even getting in touch with

1127
00:42:29,710 --> 00:42:26,900
groups and saying we could contribute

1128
00:42:31,090 --> 00:42:29,720
writers in this regard to your site to

1129
00:42:33,040 --> 00:42:31,100
add to the balance perspective on

1130
00:42:34,890 --> 00:42:33,050
occasion that that's another avenue to

1131
00:42:38,160 --> 00:42:34,900
look into this being that they may

1132
00:42:40,289 --> 00:42:38,170
actually want contributions from people

1133
00:42:42,779 --> 00:42:40,299
as well they made us not know who to ask

1134
00:42:44,069 --> 00:42:42,789
I know that Vicki hi does get into the

1135
00:42:48,079 --> 00:42:44,079
newspaper from time to time some people

1136
00:42:50,760 --> 00:42:48,089
people ring her when they need a skeptic

1137
00:42:52,500 --> 00:42:50,770
but maybe if we make it knowing that

1138
00:42:56,519 --> 00:42:52,510
there are people available II want to

1139
00:42:59,490 --> 00:42:56,529
talk who have some knowledge and there's

1140
00:43:01,410 --> 00:42:59,500
from many different qualifications here

1141
00:43:03,630 --> 00:43:01,420
aren't there I've met lawyers I've met

1142
00:43:06,420 --> 00:43:03,640
scientists journalists we've even got a

1143
00:43:08,819 --> 00:43:06,430
cartoonist people who are artists

1144
00:43:10,440 --> 00:43:08,829
students student teachers does that

1145
00:43:11,579 --> 00:43:10,450
surprise you in any way the fact that

1146
00:43:13,589 --> 00:43:11,589
people come from so many different

1147
00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:13,599
backgrounds and disciplines people are

1148
00:43:18,120 --> 00:43:16,450
shaking the head science would surprise

1149
00:43:21,329 --> 00:43:18,130
you that people that believe in strange

1150
00:43:23,579 --> 00:43:21,339
things come from all areas in all walks

1151
00:43:27,589 --> 00:43:23,589
of life and even a highly intelligent

1152
00:43:31,079 --> 00:43:27,599
people oh no disappointment here I'm

1153
00:43:37,589 --> 00:43:31,089
when the poor polar bear did anybody go

1154
00:43:39,450 --> 00:43:37,599
oh you unfeeling bastards so highly

1155
00:43:43,109 --> 00:43:39,460
intelligent but slightly sociopathic no

1156
00:43:44,460 --> 00:43:43,119
no but no i would say i would say in

1157
00:43:45,990 --> 00:43:44,470
fact you're very caring because you're

1158
00:43:48,900 --> 00:43:46,000
making the effort here to do something

1159
00:43:50,250 --> 00:43:48,910
for the community by being skeptics i

1160
00:43:52,410 --> 00:43:50,260
mean that's one of the overall messages

1161
00:43:54,690 --> 00:43:52,420
here we're caring about not only the

1162
00:43:57,150 --> 00:43:54,700
health and welfare and consumer rights

1163
00:43:58,260 --> 00:43:57,160
of these people but many of you also

1164
00:44:00,660 --> 00:43:58,270
touching upon well there's cultural

1165
00:44:03,240 --> 00:44:00,670
aspects to consider in New Zealand this

1166
00:44:05,460 --> 00:44:03,250
is Auckland after all how does that

1167
00:44:08,069 --> 00:44:05,470
impact upon being a skeptic people are

1168
00:44:10,710 --> 00:44:08,079
nodding shaking yet oh hi I'm John the

1169
00:44:12,690 --> 00:44:10,720
thing that I see about Auckland is it in

1170
00:44:16,650 --> 00:44:12,700
New Zealand and generals were small

1171
00:44:18,059 --> 00:44:16,660
diverse country where people have had to

1172
00:44:20,700 --> 00:44:18,069
get along because we're all come from

1173
00:44:23,700 --> 00:44:20,710
diverse backgrounds so there's a culture

1174
00:44:28,289 --> 00:44:23,710
of not getting at one another and that

1175
00:44:31,650 --> 00:44:28,299
there's a culture of not knocking you

1176
00:44:34,740 --> 00:44:31,660
are seen to be knocking something you

1177
00:44:36,630 --> 00:44:34,750
are a bad person skeptics get up and say

1178
00:44:38,279 --> 00:44:36,640
that sensing the murder is bad and

1179
00:44:40,410 --> 00:44:38,289
everyone else is enjoying the

1180
00:44:41,360 --> 00:44:40,420
entertainment they say get lost your

1181
00:44:43,370 --> 00:44:41,370
knocker you know

1182
00:44:46,250 --> 00:44:43,380
there's this culture there and that's a

1183
00:44:47,690 --> 00:44:46,260
problem that I see there and I'm

1184
00:44:50,090 --> 00:44:47,700
interested in finding ways around that

1185
00:44:51,680 --> 00:44:50,100
as well as that I was saying something

1186
00:44:52,880 --> 00:44:51,690
he was saying so but the only obsession

1187
00:44:54,590 --> 00:44:52,890
that was going to make is you talk about

1188
00:44:56,600 --> 00:44:54,600
cultural diversity and I'm just looking

1189
00:44:59,600 --> 00:44:56,610
around this tape around the room is that

1190
00:45:01,910 --> 00:44:59,610
anybody in this pub who is not European

1191
00:45:08,710 --> 00:45:01,920
yes I was just thinking that myself is

1192
00:45:11,090 --> 00:45:08,720
all addressed hello we have women here

1193
00:45:13,040 --> 00:45:11,100
big boys and unlike video everyone so

1194
00:45:14,540 --> 00:45:13,050
I'm relieved there are a few well I'm

1195
00:45:17,380 --> 00:45:14,550
certainly happy to represent the

1196
00:45:19,790 --> 00:45:17,390
Australians by being a female yeah yeah

1197
00:45:21,740 --> 00:45:19,800
culture is no excuse for bleeding thank

1198
00:45:24,230 --> 00:45:21,750
you how do you think you might be able

1199
00:45:26,240 --> 00:45:24,240
to tap into other people's backgrounds

1200
00:45:28,190 --> 00:45:26,250
and perhaps make them see that this is

1201
00:45:31,340 --> 00:45:28,200
something that isn't just as you said

1202
00:45:33,650 --> 00:45:31,350
white geeky boy let's all be fans of Ben

1203
00:45:37,430 --> 00:45:33,660
Goldacre and say Steve novellas a hottie

1204
00:45:38,870 --> 00:45:37,440
that sort of thing oh come on you knew

1205
00:45:40,250 --> 00:45:38,880
that you're thinking Steve novellas a

1206
00:45:42,380 --> 00:45:40,260
hottie that's why you're coming along

1207
00:45:45,080 --> 00:45:42,390
yeah that's it today's unshackling

1208
00:45:46,520 --> 00:45:45,090
yourself from your back room so I guess

1209
00:45:48,230 --> 00:45:46,530
there's a challenge there in terms of

1210
00:45:49,610 --> 00:45:48,240
other people be jeans is that the

1211
00:45:51,950 --> 00:45:49,620
cultural thing is quite strongly the

1212
00:45:53,750 --> 00:45:51,960
struggling you know and that's a hard

1213
00:45:55,640 --> 00:45:53,760
thing to breach because it's family it's

1214
00:45:58,010 --> 00:45:55,650
find out what's all that stuff as well

1215
00:45:59,930 --> 00:45:58,020
maybe one solution could be touching

1216
00:46:02,150 --> 00:45:59,940
base with people who are into consumer

1217
00:46:04,250 --> 00:46:02,160
rights organizations people with human

1218
00:46:06,170 --> 00:46:04,260
rights organizations it's good that this

1219
00:46:08,090 --> 00:46:06,180
meeting has happened because we're just

1220
00:46:10,250 --> 00:46:08,100
starting to meet people who you know

1221
00:46:12,470 --> 00:46:10,260
like minded individuals we just need to

1222
00:46:16,040 --> 00:46:12,480
get it wider diversity of people along

1223
00:46:17,390 --> 00:46:16,050
not just middle-aged males does anyone

1224
00:46:19,550 --> 00:46:17,400
have any comments you make about the

1225
00:46:21,670 --> 00:46:19,560
atheist skeptic link and interesting

1226
00:46:24,380 --> 00:46:21,680
thing an interesting thing why I

1227
00:46:27,140 --> 00:46:24,390
definitely see the link between skips as

1228
00:46:28,460 --> 00:46:27,150
and atheism because well from my

1229
00:46:31,640 --> 00:46:28,470
perspective anyway religion is that it's

1230
00:46:34,130 --> 00:46:31,650
very easy to be skeptical of and I see a

1231
00:46:35,390 --> 00:46:34,140
very strong link between not believing

1232
00:46:37,460 --> 00:46:35,400
and say alternative medicine or not

1233
00:46:39,770 --> 00:46:37,470
believe in God because they're both

1234
00:46:42,860 --> 00:46:39,780
things that have very little or no

1235
00:46:44,430 --> 00:46:42,870
evidence for them I know that there are

1236
00:46:46,170 --> 00:46:44,440
plenty of there

1237
00:46:47,579 --> 00:46:46,180
and reasonable number of religious

1238
00:46:50,460 --> 00:46:47,589
people who would also say that they're

1239
00:46:52,680 --> 00:46:50,470
skeptics and who would not believe in a

1240
00:46:55,410 --> 00:46:52,690
lot of things but on the other hand i

1241
00:46:56,579 --> 00:46:55,420
also think well you know you don't

1242
00:46:59,490 --> 00:46:56,589
believe in all these other things but

1243
00:47:00,839 --> 00:46:59,500
you believe in the sky 2,000 years ago

1244
00:47:02,849 --> 00:47:00,849
that was nailed to a tree and that means

1245
00:47:04,559 --> 00:47:02,859
all your sins is forgiven that might be

1246
00:47:06,329 --> 00:47:04,569
in fact a really good topic for debate

1247
00:47:10,020 --> 00:47:06,339
or discussion for are skeptics in the

1248
00:47:11,880 --> 00:47:10,030
pub one night danger be caught because

1249
00:47:13,490 --> 00:47:11,890
there is no pigeonhole you can't

1250
00:47:16,319 --> 00:47:13,500
pigeonhole escaped it you can't see

1251
00:47:17,940 --> 00:47:16,329
everyone here believes this and doesn't

1252
00:47:19,200 --> 00:47:17,950
believe in that because everyone has

1253
00:47:22,099 --> 00:47:19,210
their own opinions and that's been

1254
00:47:25,829 --> 00:47:22,109
formed through their entire lives and so

1255
00:47:28,559 --> 00:47:25,839
although i'm at i'm an atheist and idly

1256
00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:28,569
kind of kept away from atheism comes to

1257
00:47:32,099 --> 00:47:30,010
fighting pseudo-scientists to believe

1258
00:47:34,410 --> 00:47:32,109
you find the bed fellows that you can to

1259
00:47:35,970 --> 00:47:34,420
to fight those kind of things and there

1260
00:47:38,550 --> 00:47:35,980
may well be thousands of Christians like

1261
00:47:39,990 --> 00:47:38,560
there who find the idea of psychics

1262
00:47:41,970 --> 00:47:40,000
completely up horned against their

1263
00:47:44,280 --> 00:47:41,980
principles and we shouldn't discount

1264
00:47:46,109 --> 00:47:44,290
those people simply because we happen to

1265
00:47:48,059 --> 00:47:46,119
disagree with them about organized

1266
00:47:50,339 --> 00:47:48,069
religion and and it's one of those

1267
00:47:51,510 --> 00:47:50,349
difficult things that that we're gonna

1268
00:47:54,510 --> 00:47:51,520
have to deal with in when we have to

1269
00:47:56,640 --> 00:47:54,520
debate but but we can't afford if we're

1270
00:47:58,740 --> 00:47:56,650
going to use skepticism and the skeptics

1271
00:48:00,180 --> 00:47:58,750
in the pub in Oakland positively we

1272
00:48:02,099 --> 00:48:00,190
can't afford to ealing eat whole groups

1273
00:48:04,349 --> 00:48:02,109
of people just because they don't have

1274
00:48:06,569 --> 00:48:04,359
one specific belief that we may disagree

1275
00:48:08,760 --> 00:48:06,579
with yeah I'm kind of along the same

1276
00:48:10,440 --> 00:48:08,770
lines as Mike on there but getting back

1277
00:48:12,510 --> 00:48:10,450
to the previous thing about how we

1278
00:48:15,630 --> 00:48:12,520
actually work on the skepticism I think

1279
00:48:17,339 --> 00:48:15,640
we have to start working more on says

1280
00:48:20,760 --> 00:48:17,349
bad work more on children but educating

1281
00:48:22,140 --> 00:48:20,770
children so I've got three kids myself

1282
00:48:23,819 --> 00:48:22,150
and I know that school holidays coming

1283
00:48:25,740 --> 00:48:23,829
up a lot of the school holiday programs

1284
00:48:28,230 --> 00:48:25,750
are run through churches or church

1285
00:48:29,520 --> 00:48:28,240
groups you know Salvation Army the local

1286
00:48:31,140 --> 00:48:29,530
Baptist group all that kind of stuff and

1287
00:48:32,700 --> 00:48:31,150
there are very few other there are some

1288
00:48:35,280 --> 00:48:32,710
secular groups there are no true

1289
00:48:36,870 --> 00:48:35,290
critical thinking school camps or school

1290
00:48:38,280 --> 00:48:36,880
programs or anything like that that goes

1291
00:48:40,079 --> 00:48:38,290
around for kids and even in schools

1292
00:48:41,460 --> 00:48:40,089
there are actual you know evangelists

1293
00:48:42,720 --> 00:48:41,470
and preachers that come into schools and

1294
00:48:44,520 --> 00:48:42,730
you can give permission for your child

1295
00:48:46,470 --> 00:48:44,530
to go and listen to them and yet I think

1296
00:48:48,420 --> 00:48:46,480
there are any advantage little skeptics

1297
00:48:50,220 --> 00:48:48,430
or you know that go into schools to

1298
00:48:51,720 --> 00:48:50,230
promote critical thinking with children

1299
00:48:53,570 --> 00:48:51,730
and children are sponges they will

1300
00:48:55,820 --> 00:48:53,580
believe anything you're told

1301
00:48:58,220 --> 00:48:55,830
at the most recent dragoncon we had an

1302
00:49:00,680 --> 00:48:58,230
amazing number of parents and teachers

1303
00:49:02,180 --> 00:49:00,690
and presenting parents hopefully some of

1304
00:49:04,790 --> 00:49:02,190
the audio will come up on several of the

1305
00:49:07,250 --> 00:49:04,800
podcasts and I know that people are just

1306
00:49:09,070 --> 00:49:07,260
astounded at how much support there was

1307
00:49:11,330 --> 00:49:09,080
for the idea of a critical thinking show

1308
00:49:12,830 --> 00:49:11,340
you might know that Richard Saunders and

1309
00:49:14,900 --> 00:49:12,840
dr. Rachel Dunlop do the mystery

1310
00:49:16,520 --> 00:49:14,910
investigators which is a children's show

1311
00:49:20,210 --> 00:49:16,530
and they presented at Dragon Con this

1312
00:49:23,150 --> 00:49:20,220
year and we had mostly parents in the

1313
00:49:25,280 --> 00:49:23,160
audience a couple of kids who just went

1314
00:49:27,500 --> 00:49:25,290
nutso and ran around with dowsing rods

1315
00:49:28,910 --> 00:49:27,510
for the demonstrations but it was quite

1316
00:49:31,280 --> 00:49:28,920
a lot of parent sayings is really clever

1317
00:49:32,900 --> 00:49:31,290
I could do this or people who didn't

1318
00:49:36,800 --> 00:49:32,910
have kids but we're interested in maybe

1319
00:49:38,330 --> 00:49:36,810
the performance or presentation side and

1320
00:49:40,610 --> 00:49:38,340
saying I could probably do something

1321
00:49:43,190 --> 00:49:40,620
similar so maybe getting in touch with

1322
00:49:45,230 --> 00:49:43,200
science communication bodies presenting

1323
00:49:46,730 --> 00:49:45,240
groups at museums and so forth and

1324
00:49:48,440 --> 00:49:46,740
seeing if you could take part I believe

1325
00:49:49,700 --> 00:49:48,450
the Victorian skeptics do something

1326
00:49:51,680 --> 00:49:49,710
similar like that they have a stall

1327
00:49:54,230 --> 00:49:51,690
during science week do you have science

1328
00:49:55,940 --> 00:49:54,240
week here in New Zealand some people

1329
00:49:57,410 --> 00:49:55,950
shrugging some people nodding looking

1330
00:49:59,030 --> 00:49:57,420
looking into that might be might be

1331
00:50:00,410 --> 00:49:59,040
useful no big loss of a shrinking into

1332
00:50:02,270 --> 00:50:00,420
the cell oh god please don't make me

1333
00:50:03,590 --> 00:50:02,280
dress up as a science clown juggle for

1334
00:50:05,630 --> 00:50:03,600
the intent of the kids I can't handle

1335
00:50:06,860 --> 00:50:05,640
better anyone else have any good ideas

1336
00:50:08,630 --> 00:50:06,870
or things that they would like to do I

1337
00:50:11,590 --> 00:50:08,640
think one of the overwhelming things is

1338
00:50:16,370 --> 00:50:11,600
have fun network I think that as

1339
00:50:20,480 --> 00:50:16,380
skeptics we need to become I guess

1340
00:50:23,870 --> 00:50:20,490
polite educators especially in New

1341
00:50:25,040 --> 00:50:23,880
Zealand as you said earlier with when

1342
00:50:26,420 --> 00:50:25,050
you come up against other people they

1343
00:50:28,370 --> 00:50:26,430
don't like being rubbed the wrong way

1344
00:50:31,310 --> 00:50:28,380
we're a culture of just getting on with

1345
00:50:35,960 --> 00:50:31,320
everyone and I think what we need to do

1346
00:50:38,450 --> 00:50:35,970
is really sort of take advice from other

1347
00:50:42,830 --> 00:50:38,460
guys that have looked at you know how to

1348
00:50:45,640 --> 00:50:42,840
approach people how to I guess calm down

1349
00:50:48,290 --> 00:50:45,650
for a start stop rolling your eyes and

1350
00:50:52,250 --> 00:50:48,300
actually listen to the other people and

1351
00:50:56,540 --> 00:50:52,260
then be able to walk them through their

1352
00:50:59,540 --> 00:50:56,550
own logical state that's really and and

1353
00:51:02,060 --> 00:50:59,550
then yet sort of try and 180 them round

1354
00:51:06,510 --> 00:51:02,070
two and with kids of my own I know that

1355
00:51:09,720 --> 00:51:06,520
they look to us to show

1356
00:51:11,520 --> 00:51:09,730
what to do and where to go and if yeah

1357
00:51:13,050 --> 00:51:11,530
if they're looking at I guess the wrong

1358
00:51:16,410 --> 00:51:13,060
blackboard they're going to learn the

1359
00:51:20,340 --> 00:51:16,420
wrong stuff it's being able to show them

1360
00:51:21,600 --> 00:51:20,350
a something that is believable something

1361
00:51:22,830 --> 00:51:21,610
that they can turn around and they know

1362
00:51:27,590 --> 00:51:22,840
it's going to still be standing there

1363
00:51:30,450 --> 00:51:27,600
and really sort of give them a good base

1364
00:51:33,090 --> 00:51:30,460
so they can continue on with it's such

1365
00:51:35,510 --> 00:51:33,100
an opportunity because um the Internet

1366
00:51:38,760 --> 00:51:35,520
has made everything so much more and

1367
00:51:40,530 --> 00:51:38,770
accessible no longer no two years ago

1368
00:51:43,470 --> 00:51:40,540
three years ago four years ago you were

1369
00:51:46,170 --> 00:51:43,480
a skeptic no and you know you struggle

1370
00:51:49,830 --> 00:51:46,180
to find anyone else to to converse with

1371
00:51:51,450 --> 00:51:49,840
you know you know on Twitter and I'm in

1372
00:51:54,180 --> 00:51:51,460
contact with Kylie I mean you know em

1373
00:51:55,710 --> 00:51:54,190
with dr. Richie I've had emails from I

1374
00:51:57,930 --> 00:51:55,720
had an email from james randi it was

1375
00:51:59,610 --> 00:51:57,940
just awesome to open up my inbox and

1376
00:52:01,230 --> 00:51:59,620
find an email from james randi these

1377
00:52:02,630 --> 00:52:01,240
people aren't untouchable there are

1378
00:52:05,250 --> 00:52:02,640
people out there who are willing to help

1379
00:52:07,440 --> 00:52:05,260
all over the world and in and it would

1380
00:52:08,520 --> 00:52:07,450
be remiss not to use those kind of

1381
00:52:10,500 --> 00:52:08,530
resources and I think we've got a real

1382
00:52:11,940 --> 00:52:10,510
opportunity to be positive I think

1383
00:52:14,310 --> 00:52:11,950
that's the key thing is to be positive

1384
00:52:16,290 --> 00:52:14,320
not to be negative about skepticism but

1385
00:52:19,320 --> 00:52:16,300
we positive and kick that message to as

1386
00:52:22,050 --> 00:52:19,330
many people as as we can with without

1387
00:52:29,180 --> 00:52:22,060
without getting into the old habit of

1388
00:52:35,459 --> 00:52:31,650
yes he did he got an email out of James

1389
00:52:37,349 --> 00:52:35,469
Randi I think that's a good point that

1390
00:52:40,349 --> 00:52:37,359
you touched on and one that that I find

1391
00:52:42,509 --> 00:52:40,359
irritating to is this idea that if that

1392
00:52:44,190 --> 00:52:42,519
there's such negativity associated with

1393
00:52:46,200 --> 00:52:44,200
it if you were a few trying to be

1394
00:52:47,969 --> 00:52:46,210
rational and reasonable it's like you're

1395
00:52:49,440 --> 00:52:47,979
cold and unfeeling and you're not really

1396
00:52:51,809 --> 00:52:49,450
compassionate and you don't really

1397
00:52:55,650 --> 00:52:51,819
understand how I feel and you know

1398
00:52:56,999 --> 00:52:55,660
there's that real negativity whereas i'm

1399
00:52:58,890 --> 00:52:57,009
normally trying to say well actually

1400
00:53:01,589 --> 00:52:58,900
it's because i really care deeply about

1401
00:53:03,150 --> 00:53:01,599
you know this poor child not dying

1402
00:53:04,769 --> 00:53:03,160
because they have cancer win this

1403
00:53:06,959 --> 00:53:04,779
perfectly good medical treatment

1404
00:53:08,519 --> 00:53:06,969
available to them that's why you know

1405
00:53:12,420 --> 00:53:08,529
all these people in jail who shouldn't

1406
00:53:14,279 --> 00:53:12,430
be that's why i get so i guess i'm

1407
00:53:16,140 --> 00:53:14,289
passionate about it it's not a negative

1408
00:53:19,019 --> 00:53:16,150
thing that it's actually because you can

1409
00:53:21,359 --> 00:53:19,029
that that's why you you are escaped it

1410
00:53:22,890 --> 00:53:21,369
you mentioned the internet as a powerful

1411
00:53:24,359 --> 00:53:22,900
force for getting people together where

1412
00:53:27,599 --> 00:53:24,369
can people go to find out more about the

1413
00:53:29,430 --> 00:53:27,609
auckland skeptics okay i started

1414
00:53:32,579 --> 00:53:29,440
christchurch skeptics in the pub about

1415
00:53:34,400 --> 00:53:32,589
three or four months ago and we've got

1416
00:53:36,599 --> 00:53:34,410
it down to the point now where we have

1417
00:53:37,920 --> 00:53:36,609
fortnightly meetings alternating monday

1418
00:53:39,089 --> 00:53:37,930
and tuesday because some people can't

1419
00:53:41,279 --> 00:53:39,099
make it on Monday some people can't make

1420
00:53:42,839 --> 00:53:41,289
it on Tuesday we also have monthly video

1421
00:53:44,759 --> 00:53:42,849
evenings but they tend to be a more

1422
00:53:48,089 --> 00:53:44,769
atheists theme thing but I'm fine with

1423
00:53:49,680 --> 00:53:48,099
that I've also started this one and mike

1424
00:53:51,719 --> 00:53:49,690
has been put in charge of this one

1425
00:53:53,849 --> 00:53:51,729
because well I don't live here yeah and

1426
00:53:55,079 --> 00:53:53,859
we've also started the Wellington

1427
00:53:56,700 --> 00:53:55,089
skeptics in the pub meet up and

1428
00:54:00,900 --> 00:53:56,710
hopefully the first meeting of that will

1429
00:54:03,120 --> 00:54:00,910
be on the night opening night of the New

1430
00:54:05,309 --> 00:54:03,130
Zealand skeptics conference 2009 in

1431
00:54:07,049 --> 00:54:05,319
Wellington brilliant so you have the new

1432
00:54:09,539 --> 00:54:07,059
zealand skeptics conference coming up

1433
00:54:11,309 --> 00:54:09,549
soon we do at the end of the month and i

1434
00:54:12,839 --> 00:54:11,319
hope that some people here will not find

1435
00:54:14,940 --> 00:54:12,849
it too difficult to make the jump across

1436
00:54:16,440 --> 00:54:14,950
the ocean in order to see some of the

1437
00:54:17,880 --> 00:54:16,450
australian conferences that are coming

1438
00:54:19,799 --> 00:54:17,890
to have people got plans for those i

1439
00:54:21,329 --> 00:54:19,809
want one hand people were waving hands

1440
00:54:22,709 --> 00:54:21,339
people are nodding we'll see how it goes

1441
00:54:24,539 --> 00:54:22,719
and certainly I hope that some of the

1442
00:54:25,799 --> 00:54:24,549
members from those conferences will be

1443
00:54:28,170 --> 00:54:25,809
able to head towards New Zealand because

1444
00:54:29,910 --> 00:54:28,180
you are a country with with an identity

1445
00:54:31,650 --> 00:54:29,920
that deserves just as much respect as

1446
00:54:34,979 --> 00:54:31,660
Australia it's just as much as us

1447
00:54:36,930 --> 00:54:34,989
possibly a little bit more so good so

1448
00:54:38,190 --> 00:54:36,940
all hail to Auckland skeptics and thank

1449
00:54:39,959 --> 00:54:38,200
you very much ladies and gentlemen for

1450
00:54:45,480 --> 00:54:39,969
being part of the first think tank in

1451
00:54:50,320 --> 00:54:48,580
the official meetup com site for the

1452
00:54:54,390 --> 00:54:50,330
Auckland skeptics can be found on

1453
00:54:56,860 --> 00:54:54,400
Auckland skeptics in the pub net NZ

1454
00:54:59,500 --> 00:54:56,870
skeptics in New Zealand should also be

1455
00:55:13,000 --> 00:54:59,510
checking out skeptics in the pub dotnet

1456
00:55:17,850 --> 00:55:13,010
dealt NZ there's a new podcast called

1457
00:55:21,010 --> 00:55:17,860
the geologic podcast a balanced come

1458
00:55:25,990 --> 00:55:21,020
rational look at the world and all of

1459
00:55:28,600 --> 00:55:26,000
the people in it mother ah four notes

1460
00:55:30,940 --> 00:55:28,610
away all right here's the deal is the

1461
00:55:33,910 --> 00:55:30,950
sky ladies George raw but he's got his

1462
00:55:35,980 --> 00:55:33,920
geologic podcast maybe the last figure

1463
00:55:37,450 --> 00:55:35,990
what I do is listen to this garbage I'll

1464
00:55:39,460 --> 00:55:37,460
be look at the code of things he does

1465
00:55:45,430 --> 00:55:39,470
he's got his one big is called religious

1466
00:55:47,680 --> 00:55:45,440
were out of the week baby does this

1467
00:55:51,030 --> 00:55:47,690
stupid Hitler's grammar talks about

1468
00:55:55,030 --> 00:55:51,040
entertainment news it must be time for

1469
00:55:57,100 --> 00:55:55,040
grandma's entertainment report that's

1470
00:55:59,560 --> 00:55:57,110
this george karl has got some strange

1471
00:56:03,610 --> 00:55:59,570
fascination with edibles ray talks about

1472
00:56:08,020 --> 00:56:03,620
them and then called interesting phone

1473
00:56:14,550 --> 00:56:08,030
I mean it's all just so stupid the last

1474
00:56:19,950 --> 00:56:16,960
believe your time will be better spent

1475
00:56:38,060 --> 00:56:19,960
making yourself a sandwich or something

1476
00:56:42,930 --> 00:56:40,560
so New Zealand's a bit of a party town a

1477
00:56:45,870 --> 00:56:42,940
Stefan New Zealand is a big party town I

1478
00:56:48,240 --> 00:56:45,880
couldn't could not believe how many pubs

1479
00:56:50,340 --> 00:56:48,250
they were in that in that place I don't

1480
00:56:51,990 --> 00:56:50,350
whether all I have a suspicion because I

1481
00:56:54,210 --> 00:56:52,000
was after hours that all the shops they

1482
00:56:56,640 --> 00:56:54,220
sort of they said all if shopfronts

1483
00:56:58,440 --> 00:56:56,650
actually wrote revolve around and will

1484
00:56:59,940 --> 00:56:58,450
and all those sort of bars and bottle

1485
00:57:01,890 --> 00:56:59,950
shops and stuffs that are replaced on

1486
00:57:03,360 --> 00:57:01,900
high it was I couldn't believe it well

1487
00:57:04,320 --> 00:57:03,370
those new zealand skeptics certainly

1488
00:57:06,660 --> 00:57:04,330
sound like they're having a good time

1489
00:57:09,570 --> 00:57:06,670
new zealand skeptics in the pub and you

1490
00:57:12,450 --> 00:57:09,580
heard the details there on Kylie's think

1491
00:57:14,220 --> 00:57:12,460
tank how to get involved New Zealand

1492
00:57:16,260 --> 00:57:14,230
people get involved I mean I needed over

1493
00:57:19,110 --> 00:57:16,270
there there's a few crazies few wackos

1494
00:57:21,120 --> 00:57:19,120
oh yeah they did a little bit of a level

1495
00:57:23,220 --> 00:57:21,130
headedness over there in New Zealand

1496
00:57:24,510 --> 00:57:23,230
yeah you know where to go and suss it

1497
00:57:26,250 --> 00:57:24,520
out I think you should reach I think you

1498
00:57:28,260 --> 00:57:26,260
need to go there's the ambassador I do

1499
00:57:30,660 --> 00:57:28,270
and sort it out yeah I don't do enough

1500
00:57:32,760 --> 00:57:30,670
travel now you do something you know I

1501
00:57:34,740 --> 00:57:32,770
don't do it let me go all right you go

1502
00:57:37,320 --> 00:57:34,750
okay I'll go so what's gonna happen next

1503
00:57:39,240 --> 00:57:37,330
week next week is our special one year

1504
00:57:41,130 --> 00:57:39,250
anniversary episode of the skeptic zone

1505
00:57:45,540 --> 00:57:41,140
with the live skeptic zone from

1506
00:57:48,810 --> 00:57:45,550
dragoncon Wow next year many are gonna

1507
00:57:52,440 --> 00:57:48,820
be there with ya well it looks like

1508
00:57:54,720 --> 00:57:52,450
let's do a movement get Stefan out of

1509
00:57:56,550 --> 00:57:54,730
the country or get Stefan to dragon to

1510
00:57:58,230 --> 00:57:56,560
dragoncon actually I'm get I've got a

1511
00:58:01,290 --> 00:57:58,240
plan to get there yeah I've actually

1512
00:58:02,940 --> 00:58:01,300
created my own New Age product which I'm

1513
00:58:04,860 --> 00:58:02,950
going to be offering for sale soon and

1514
00:58:06,870 --> 00:58:04,870
with the with the funds of the funds

1515
00:58:09,240 --> 00:58:06,880
from the product I'm going to use to get

1516
00:58:10,560 --> 00:58:09,250
a drink I hear about that Oh big

1517
00:58:11,730 --> 00:58:10,570
announcements coming out Gyptian all

1518
00:58:13,610 --> 00:58:11,740
right sir either the next couple weeks

1519
00:58:16,050 --> 00:58:13,620
fix or maybe even at the birthday chat

1520
00:58:18,020 --> 00:58:16,060
see you next week Richard buys there all

1521
00:58:19,480 --> 00:58:18,030
right

1522
00:58:25,540 --> 00:58:19,490
you

1523
00:58:29,290 --> 00:58:25,550
zone visit our website at www skeptics

1524
00:58:31,930 --> 00:58:29,300
on TV for comments contacts and extra

1525
00:58:43,120 --> 00:58:31,940
video reports